0:00What's up everybody? Today we're breaking down some of the biggest questions from the league's reigning six ranked scoring offense, including who is
0:06even RB1 here? Well, last year's number two overall pick even be playing much offense and who stands out inside this rather loaded wide receiver room. We are
0:14talking all thing Jags wires with John Shipley himself, your favorite beat reporter's favorite beat reporter. John, thanks for hanging out on man.
0:22>> Hey, appreciate having me on, man. I I you know love coming on and it's exciting team to talk about for one of
0:27the few times I've been covering >> 100% man again it's just this mixture of obviously coming off one of the better
0:35seasons you know in the franchise's recent memory but with still so many question marks there so I think a lot of
0:39us do believe in the Trevor Lawrence Liam Cohen partnership overall but man we need people like you with boots on the ground to help us fantasy nerds try
0:47to figure out who's even going to be touching the football so John want to get right into it which is the biggest
0:51question big picture how do you see the Baltude and Chris Rodriguez Laquent Allen committee unfold.
0:57>> Yeah, it it's it's one of those things where you know there there was a they had their team scrimmage on Friday and
1:04one of the big things was they did kind of I think show a little bit of maybe what the big picture looks like. You
1:11know, uh I I don't think much in terms of maybe who went out there first, but Tuton did a lot of, you know, in between
1:16the 20s work. Once they got near the red zone, it was, you know, Chris Rodriguez, especially in short yardage. uh Laquent
1:23Allen basically was on the field for every single third down. I I think that's going to be probably similar, but in terms of actual split, I still think
1:30the Jaguars themselves don't know. And I don't think it's a they don't know because there's kind of clues. I think they're going to let it kind of sort
1:38itself out because I mean, when you look at the profiles of, you know, specifically to Nin Rodriguez, you know, Liam Cohen spoke in March about, you
1:45know, the things he values the most in running backs being yards after contact, rushing yards over expectation. I mean, both both those guys fared pretty well
1:54there in terms of their profiles. I know Tudin, him being such a short yardage guy last year kind of skewed his numbers
2:00a little bit. he had so many of those goal line carries. But I mean, Chris Rodriguez, if you just look at like the
2:04pure metrics that, you know, Liam Cohen has said that he values the most, he's one of the more efficient running backs
2:10in the league, you add in Liam's relationship with him. And it's pretty easy for me to see him having a fairly
2:16significant role in the offense despite, you know, I know everybody's saying is, well, you know, he's Chris Rodriguez.
2:21He's never, you know, he didn't have a significant role with Washington, right?
2:24I think it could be different this year.
2:26I really think it could be a, you know, game script can, you know, define what it looks like. Uh, you know, kind of
2:33riding the hot hand cuz Liam showed us in Tampa. He he can get three running backs on the field. He did it last year
2:41to a lesser extent, but he's shown before that. I I really think that they're okay with an offense where maybe one guy isn't the lead back and they're
2:49kind of going with a by committee approach. But I mean, both guys have been impressive so far in training camp.
2:55I think Rodriguez, especially since the pads have come on, you've seen that ability to get the tough yards. And then Judin, I mean, he he he's been popping
3:03off long runs the last several practices, even when the running game was kind of slow at the start of training camp. He his biggest thing, you
3:10know, last year, and he even noted it this off seasonason, was I mean, going from, you know, small school in North
3:17Carolina to Virginia Tech to NFL all in a quick span, you know, the NFL offense was a lot for him. and you know he he
3:24you know told me it during the offseason that coaches basically told him they're like when you know more or less when you
3:28know what you're doing you're doing really well. He feels like he has a better grasp of the offense now. So I I
3:34know it's kind of the political answer but I I don't know if they do know if there's an RB1 or even if one exists
3:40because I I think that they do think they're all talented kind of in different ways.
3:44>> For sure. For sure. Did want to again give some props to Chris Rodriguez though because you're right. Sometimes we kind of throw him in there like oh
3:50really is Chris Rodriguez could be a problem. My just issue though coming into summer was this foot injury that was going on. But again, your opinion
3:57right now, he looks fully back to 100%.
3:59>> Yeah. Yeah. He I mean he started the first several days of training camp, he didn't get like a single team rep. He
4:04was just doing individual drills. They said he was cleared, but they were slowly easing him in. And then it seems like with each practice, he's doing a
4:11little bit more and more. And then yesterday's practice, it almost seemed like him and Tudin had kind of an even split in terms of work, you know, with
4:18the first team offense. So, you know, they've said that they're that they don't believe he'll be an issue for week one. And everything I've seen so far, I
4:26I don't think so. As well, >> it is one of those things, guys, again, looking at the ADP right now, all of us
4:30are so so confident Bashaw Tunes could be the lead back. I do think he can make an argument he has the most upside
4:35overall, but Chris Rodriguez maybe low-key could be in a bit more of a, you know, poor man's Dave Montgomery or middle class man's Jordan Mason,
4:43whatever you want to call it sort of role. So again, if this offense is going to be great, and we're seeing them in
4:46short yardage, really could be even more than one running back that got going. As John mentioned before, Rashad Boy and Bucky Irving both turned in top 24
4:54numbers under the toutelage of Liam Cohen a few short years ago. As always, do invite you guys. If you want more
4:59fancy info, rotoire.com, code Ian20, 20% off any of our lovely subs if you're trying to win a few extra dollars playing fancy football this year. But
5:07John, back to your Jaguars and back to the passing game, man. Because again, muddle committee, we get it. But let's face it, you know, Travis UTM was doing
5:14his thing last year, but really in my opinion, like the breakout down the stretch was Trevor Lawrence playing the single best football of his career.
5:21Didn't come though with Travis Hunter actually active on the offensive side of the ball flash before he got injured.
5:27But how much have you actually seen Hunter playing offense? Because again, you look at the depth chart and we tend to believe, oh, okay, they need him a
5:33little bit more at quarterback. But I don't know, man. You use number two overall pick on the guy. You trade all
5:37those draft picks. You would like to think they're still going to use him on offense. What have you seen?
5:42>> Yeah, I think there was a misconception this off seasonason when you know it became clear that Hunter was going to
5:49play more of a role at corner that maybe it meant not a role on offense. Is it as big of a you know he entered last year
5:56as a you know clue starter on the offense and then kind of dabbled on defensive side. I don't think it would
6:01be that. But I mean I'll say what they've done with him in training camp.
6:05last year he would start a practice at receiver and then spend you know if he's where he started practice he would spend
6:10pretty much the whole day there now he's playing both sides and every single practice that I've seen the numbers have skewed toward defense I think you know
6:20Mike Draco with ESPN the Jags ESPN beat does a great job of doing uh his best to try to track all Travis under 11 on 111
6:28reps you know switching the jerseys and everything I think he's has like around 90 11 on1 reps at corner 150 something
6:35at receiver. So he is playing more corner and I do think his role will skew a bit more corner this year just based
6:42on how their team is made up. But I mean he he's pretty clearly to me still going to have some kind of role on offense.
6:49They're still working him in with the first team offense. You know is he playing as much as Parker Washington with the offense? No. I wouldn't even
6:56say as Jacobe Myers or Brian Thomas, but it's not a situation where you know they drafted two six round receivers. Neither
7:02one of them is going to play more than Travis. Travis, I think, is going to play a fairly decent amount on offense
7:08considering he's also probably going to be their number one quarterback. Now, >> what does that mean for him on a week-
7:14toeek role? That I think still remains to be seen because like I said, it's different than what they did last year.
7:20He was really one of their starting receivers until he got hurt last year.
7:23Was probably going to have the passing game funneled through him. You know, when he had gotten hurt, that was at least all the signs. But, you know, and
7:30I from what I've seen from him, I think they're taking a different approach with him just in terms of usage, too. Last
7:36year, they kind of stuck him in the slot, you know, did a lot of the, you know, gimmicky kind of stuff. A lot of
7:41screens that, you know, such a good screen player, their screen game was terrible last year. There's less of that that I've seen in camp so far. I've seen
7:49more letting him be on the outside, letting him win downfield vertically, which I think is more so his game, even if he can't do those amazing things with
7:57the ball in his hand. So, do do I think like he's going to be, you know, playing 80 85% of the snaps at receiver and be
8:04what you would expect out of receiver you pick number two overall? I don't because he's just such a unique case.
8:09But I do think they're going to get some value from him on offense this year.
8:12Probably more so than people expected coming into the summer.
8:15>> Good to hear some good, you know, downfield action though. I mean, for my money's worth just watching them last year, skying up above the Chiefs dudes,
8:21you know, just really making some nice plays at the catch point. So, love to see them leaning into that. You mentioned though not playing at nearly
8:27as much as Parker Washington or the other guys. I'm just trying to put two and two together. If Hunter is coming in
8:32more so on the outside, BTJ, Meyers, are they usually coming off before Parker in these situations?
8:38I from what I've seen in training camp and there's a limit in terms of what teams like like you can't say specific
8:46usage. I think Parker Washington is going to lead the Jaguars receivers and snaps in Rapture. And honestly, I'm not sure how close it's going to be either.
8:54I I'm not seeing Parker Washington off the field very much for the Jaguars.
8:59>> You think he's already got the gold jacket fitted? It sounds like it's been a pretty game.
9:02>> It it it seems so like their entire strategy for their passing game is to, you know, spread the love, spread the
9:09ball around. You know, we don't have a quote unquote number one because that's how they'll attack you. But if they had
9:15a number one, if you had to pick a guy, I I think it's Parker Washington. I mean, he him and Trevor are now going
9:20into their fourth year kind of throwing together and you can see that chemistry.
9:24I mean, they they had a play during Sunday's practice where Trevor just uncorked the ball. It had to be like 50
9:2955 yards and Parker runs right under and it and Trevor had said they, you know, had worked on that play, you know, a ton
9:36before practice, a ton in the weeks prior. And that kind of chemistry, I just think it's been evident. And there's been nobody who's really been
9:43able to cover him. That's not to say, you know, the other guys haven't been impressive. I think Brian Thomas Junior's had some really good days. He's
9:49looked good also as a vertical threat, but also looked better going across the middle. Jacobe Meyers when they get on third downs and, you know, in the red
9:56zone drills, he's been fantastic. But Parker is the guy who, you know, I think if people are trying to figure out who's
10:02on the field when they're in 12, who's on the field in the instances when they do go 13, I I think it's Parker
10:09Washington.
10:10>> I love the chemistry angle there. Again, this is your eighth season, I believe, on the Jags beat. So you've seen
10:15everyone that Trevor Lawrence has been throwing the football to and even a few before that >> with with Parker look Jaguars receivers
10:24since Trevor got to Jacksonville they lead the NFL in drops man I don't think it's all been on taw obviously it's a
10:30drop that's a wide receiver stat but like Calvin Ridley so many near misses Christian Kirk had some good years but again just not quite like booming in
10:37your opinion like is the Taw Parker Washington just chemistry at another level than any other receiver we've seen >> yeah I I it it's hard for me to think of
10:46any other receiver who had this kind of chemistry with Trevor. I'd say Kirk was maybe close, but and you know I I think
10:55you maybe this is you know some recency bias but I think the Parker Washington 2026 is better than any version of
11:02Christian Kirk that you know the Jaguars got. I you know guys who played with Trevor for multiple years Z Jones I
11:09don't think you know that connection was really anything like Trevor and Parker.
11:13Marvin Jones, same there. Uh, going to the Laquan Treadwell and Tavon Austin deep hits from the urban year. Now, I I
11:22I I think and Liam made the same point, uh, you know, early in training camp. He said out of all the guys in the offense,
11:28you know, Parker and Brenn Strange are the two that he's thrown to the most cuz I mean it it's sometimes hard to believe
11:34because of how productive he was, but he really has barely thrown the Jacobe Myers. And then obviously Brian, you know, last year Brian was injured and
11:42they had their issues with connecting.
11:43Then the year before Trevor was injured.
11:45You you can just see the pure volume of reps that Trevor and Parker have had together come together on the field. And
11:52I I I think that is a big reason like that trust level is very very big, you know, for any quarterback, but
11:58especially Trevor.
12:00>> You mentioned BTJ, you know, kind of battling through some ailments last season. was able to get out there and battle through, you know, on Sunday, but
12:05us, you know, just watching TV, we never know exactly what these guys are going through. Just also, man, uncar uncharacteristic drops. I don't want to
12:12say the dude had the yips out there, but just routine plays that we expect someone like Brian Thomas to make weren't really made last year. Do you
12:18see him looking more like just the world beater we saw in 2024 or just again good football player just kind of being part
12:25of the offense? Yeah, it was. So, like his rookie year all the way up until probably like 75% of the way through
12:34training camp, you're like, "All right, where is this guy?" And then he has a joint practice against the Buccaneers where he just tears them up and then he
12:41has this great season. So, a lot of, you know, people among the Beat thought, all right, maybe he's just a gamer, you
12:47know, he's not a practice player. Last year, his training camp was brutal last year. it it his you know training camp
12:55there were times you know last year in camp where you could tell I mean the Jaguars have said they were working on
13:01Jacobe Meyers trade during training camp they traded for Tim Patrick before week one they clearly had concerns about their receiver room fairly early in the
13:08year him and Trevor just could not get on the same page and then it carried over into the season. and their first
13:15play of the season was a, you know, a go ball to Brian that they it just it was nowhere near being completed. And I
13:21turned to somebody and I said, "That looks like every single target between them in training camp."
13:25>> And then this year, it started in the off season, it it it's it's looked a lot different. It's looked more like,
13:33>> you know, they're on the same page. Not nearly as much as I'd say Parker and Trevor, but at least closer to that,
13:39whereas last year it looked like just two puzzle pieces that didn't fit together. And Brian's doing more than simply just winning downfield. He had a
13:47nice touchdown in the middle of the field on a contested catch during their scrimmage. I I think you are seeing a
13:52version of Brian Thomas that is closer to 2024 version 2025.
13:58If if we'll ever find out really why he had a down year. I'm not sure. I think there are a multitude of factors,
14:05injuries, um and his role in the offense. They clearly wanted him to kind of be an alpha dog. you know, let's flow
14:11our whole passing game through you receiver to start the season. And it just, you know, didn't work out that way. So now I do think he's closer to,
14:20like you said, a productive guy who's a part of the offense. I think he's closer to that in terms of what his role will be than
14:27he is from 2024 where he's just, you know, the absolute, you know, go-to guy on the offense. cuz I do think I think
14:35there'll be games where he might have three catches, 25 yards, and then the next week he has 100 something yards and
14:41two touchdowns. I I just think that's the kind of season he's going to have.
14:43And but I do think that the Jaguars, they're okay with it. I think that they're completely content with him being a part of, you know, a highowered
14:51offense that maybe doesn't specify one guy. Does Brian's like game kind of translate to that? I think that remains to be seen because his game you would
15:00think kind of translates more to the high ball, you know, just keep chucking it at him. But I have seen an improved
15:06Brian Thomas and I mean Liam Cohen the thing I love about cover and Liam is I mean he he doesn't know how to keep
15:14anything to himself as you saw during the whole Robin Salah stuff. Liam's very, you know, wears his heart on his sleeve. So, he he'll tell you when he's
15:22down on a player. He's been effusive with his praise for Brian Thomas this year, this training camp, this offseason. And that wasn't the case last
15:31year when he was going through his thing. So, I I do think that's something.
15:35>> And he is again just piece of the offense where if you can get that connection going, man, just makes everything that much easier underneath
15:41the intermediate when you got to worry about that demon, you know, getting behind the secondary and everything like that. Could even make it easier for
15:46Brettton Strange. obviously got a nice little contract extension this off season, but also drafted multiple tight ends, including with their actual, you
15:53know, first pick in the second round.
15:55Have you seen like in team periods more of an emphasis on multi-tighten formations than maybe what you've seen in the past? Yeah, there's definitely
16:01been more of that because I I I think that they just internally, you know, like their tight end room this year more
16:08than they did last year when, you know, backups of Johnny Munt and Horn Long.
16:12You know, the whole thing, you know, how I think Liam kind of views it is, you know, he is perfectly okay with playing
16:1911 personnel all game if he has to because he has the receivers to do it, but he is open to expanding it more, you
16:26know, multiple tight end usage if he has the pieces. I don't think he thought thought he had the pieces last year cuz
16:32I mean you come out in 12 personnel with Johnny Munt and try to make it look like 11 or whatever. Nobody's going to
16:38respect that. It's it's it's Johnny Mont. Same with same with Hunter Long. I I think that their hope is that, you
16:43know, Nate Boracher specifically, you know, is able to kind of step in and give them something in terms of, you know, holding his own on the line of
16:51scrimmage to kind of free up Brendon Strange. Now, doesn't it make sense to use a number 56 pick to make sure
16:56Brendon Strange doesn't have to block more? That's that's a fair debate to have, but that seems kind of what they want to do. They want to have another
17:04guy who can kind of, you know, do what Strange did last year, which is, you know, Strange was consistently setting going on the line of scrimmage, you
17:11know, both in the run game and the pass game. You know, you look at a lot of his catches, a lot of chip releases, and
17:16then he's just kind of catching as a checkdown. I I think that they want to do more of Strange this year. And the
17:21way I believe that they want to do it is, okay, when we come out in 12 personnel now, we can move Bren Strange
17:27around the formation. we can put him in the slot. We can line him up out wide because you're not asking Hunter Long to
17:32block Will Anderson anymore. That's that's how I think they kind of see it.
17:36And I do I think that they're going to be like a league leader in 12. I I don't think so. But I think definitely more in
17:42last year where they were like I think mid20s in 12 personnel usage.
17:47>> It is wild just again looking all these different pieces at tight end. Now we have the Parker Washington breakout.
17:52They brought in Jacobe Myers. BTJ is playing better. I mean, is it safe to say this offense in general looking a
17:57lot more smooth than August and, you know, year two of Taw and Liam Cohen versus last August?
18:02>> Oh, yeah. I mean, LA last August it it was it was sputtering because, you know, guys have, you know, said multiple guys,
18:11you know, on the offensive roster have told me dating back to last year that Liam's offense is the like most complex
18:17and hardest that they've had to learn.
18:19Like Liam simply, you know, throws a lot out at him. You could see, I mean, through their first seven games, they
18:24were four and three. Trevor was bottom, you know, quarter percentile in pretty much every key quarterback metric. And then they just get hot. Now, a big part
18:34of that was you have Jacobe Myers instead of Demi Brown and so on and so forth. But I I I think that this is an
18:42offense that's definitely looking smoother than it did this time of year.
18:46I think this is pretty easily the best supporting cast I've seen around Trevor Lawrence. I've seen Trevor Lawrence teams where his top weapons were James
18:54Robinson and Leisa Chanel. So the way that they've kind of rebuilt this offense just in terms of pure skill talent around him I I think is one of
19:04the more impressive things that they've done. So yeah, some of the guys were here. Ryan Thomas was here, Brennan Stranger was here, Parker Washington was
19:10here, but bringing in Jacobe Myers, and then I mean Travis Hunter, even if he's not going to be obviously one of the top
19:16snap guys at receiver, it's a very poor way to phrase it for a number two pick, but best receiver for in the NFL by a [laughter] wide margin.
19:26That's just kind of how they're built.
19:28>> It's funny, we talked about Johnny Munt recently, who Kevin Oonnell once upon a time said was the best number three
19:33tight end in the NFL. So, I do get what you're saying and again, it's just good pieces that really do help out the
19:38overall offense. So, I did notice that uh you know, unprovoked shot Leiscus Chenalt, though, John. Dozens of us still believe. Okay, the man's not done
19:46yet.
19:47>> I was all in on Leiscus Chanel. Yeah, I I I was I I thought Leviscnalt was going to be And then what was it? The 2020
19:54draft. Everybody thought the 2020 Jaguars were going to be just god awful.
19:58Week one, James Robinson, Leisa Chanel dunk on the Colts and all of Jacksonville thought they had their next pieces and then they lose like 15 games
20:06in a row and Leisa's barely hurt for him ever again. It's I was all in on though, man. I thought it was going to be great.
20:13>> There's always, you know, 20 24 Saints were just world beaters in the first two weeks. Then injuries happen or just
20:19regression hits or you find out you just played a really bad team in week one.
20:22But I do live love when we get that, you know, yearly storyline. Anything can happen in the NFL. John, thank you so
20:27much, man. You want to throw a bull call out there before you leave? Just saying you could.
20:33>> Wait, what was that? One more. What >> I said? Do you have a bull call you want to throw out there? I'm not forcing you.
20:38>> I'll I'll go with I believe that Nate Boracher by week has three touchdown catches and
20:49less than 10 actual catches.
20:52>> Wow.
20:52>> I I think Liam Cohen has seen every every Yeah. Wow. this was a reach and will purposely scheme him up touchdown
20:59like Hunter Long had like two touchdowns in the first month last year. Nate Borger Nate Borger today I think Liam Cohen will go out of his way to make him
21:06a touchdown vulture.
21:09>> I don't know about you guys listening to this but I will be having some first touchdown Nate Borger tickets going on
21:14this year and their bye-week is week seven everyone. So I thought you were going to just sell me some more Parker
21:19Washington propaganda and I would have taken a job. Okay, I'll get away with I'll get away with it. [laughter] >> John Shipley again. Catch John all of
21:28his fantastic stuff at Jaguars on SI.
21:31Thank you so much, John. Best of luck to you and best of luck to your Jaguars this season, guys. That's that's going
21:35to wrap up this edition of the show though. Hope you enjoyed it. If you like the show, please like the show. Hit that
21:39subscribe button. Always helps as well.
21:41So, training camp, we're here. Preseason action coming up. John and I are so so excited. So, best of luck to all you and
21:46your fantasy drafts. And yeah, let's keep on talking ball. Why the hell not?
21:50So for John, I'm Ian.