PodcastFrom Bootleg Football
The sometimes almost best team in the league.
STACKED extracted the fantasy-relevant player signal from this podcast and kept the full transcript here for context.
1 hr 24 min
Duration
Estimated from transcript
Aug 13, 2026
Published
Thu, August 13, 2026
15
Player insights
12
Players mentioned
Topics
Christian WatsonJordan LoveTucker KraftBo MeltonCaleb WilliamsD.J. MooreEmanuel WilsonJaden NixonJayden ReedLuke MusgraveMalik WillisRJ Maryland
Player analysis
Player insights
Bo Melton
NegativeRole44:36
Bo Melton is valued at $1.1 million as a versatile depth piece who earns his roster spot by playing special teams and filling in as an emergency defensive back or wide receiver.
Insight pageCaleb Williams
NegativeValue4:14
Caleb Williams was ranked over Jordan Love in some summer quarterback rankings, a move the source views as part of 'summer rage bait' designed to drive engagement rather than reflecting actual football analysis.
Insight pageChristian Watson
NegativeInjury17:12
Christian Watson missed seven games during the 2025 season, which significantly impacted the Packers' offensive consistency and ability to maintain their high-variance, low-possession style.
Insight pagePositiveUsage45:08
Christian Watson is described as a 'force multiplier' whose presence on the field transforms the Packers' offense into the league's number one pass EPA unit. Despite durability concerns, his gravity opens space for Jordan Love and Tucker Kraft.
Insight pageD.J. Moore
PositiveUsage0:17
DJ Moore is highlighted as a key playmaker for the Bears, specifically noted for catching a touchdown pass from Caleb Williams in a game that contributed to the Packers' playoff loss.
Insight pageEmanuel Wilson
PositiveUsage43:52
Emmanuel Wilson is highlighted as a great value signing for the Seahawks at under $1.6 million; he ran the ball strongly for Green Bay, appearing on over 30% of their snaps.
Insight pageJaden Nixon
PositiveSleeper110:25
Jaden Nixon is a fast, slashing running back with significant special teams utility as a kick returner. While he lacks the size to be an every-down back and struggles to break tackles, his explosive speed makes him a candidate for RB4 and a potential weapon in space.
Insight pageJayden Reed
PositiveValue45:22
The source views Jaden Reed's $16.7 million contract as a good value, suggesting he likely could have commanded more on the open market given his quality as a wide receiver.
Insight pageJordan Love
PositiveProjection3:31
The source asserts that Jordan Love is an elite quarterback who must be ranked in the top ten, noting he plays on 'hard mode' and executes Matt LaFleur's scheme at a very high level.
Insight pagePositiveProjection50:30
The source identifies Jordan Love as a key component of the Packers' high-ceiling offense. When Love and Matt LaFleur are in sync, the team is considered dangerous enough to compete with anyone in the NFC, provided the roster remains healthy.
Insight pageLuke Musgrave
NegativeRole120:19
Luke Musgrave has struggled to translate his college potential to the NFL, with the source noting his lackluster performance and injury history. While he remains a TE2/TE3 candidate with movement skills, he is currently overshadowed by the development of Tucker Craft.
Insight pageMalik Willis
PositiveValue42:48
The source notes that Malik Willis was never expected to be a long-term piece for Green Bay, but his success and subsequent $22.5 million deal with Miami serves as a recruiting pitch for the Packers' ability to develop quarterbacks.
Insight pageRJ Maryland
PositiveValue118:01
RJ Maryland is a dynamic receiving tight end who flashed on tape. As a UDFA, he is considered a value pick who could see looks in camp while Tucker Craft recovers from injury.
Insight pageTucker Kraft
NegativeInjury10:17
Tucker Kraft missed time during the 2025 season, contributing to the Packers' late-season skid where they managed only one win in their final five games.
Insight pagePositiveBreakout122:17
Tucker Craft has developed rapidly and is viewed by the source as potentially one of the best tight ends in the NFL when healthy. His emergence provides the Packers with a high-end option, though he is currently dealing with an injury.
Insight pageFull transcript
Episode Transcript
0:0090%. For most of our lives, 90% is enough.
0:03It gets you an A in the class, it gets you into college, it gets you drafted, it gets you on the team.
0:10It gets you acceptably close to your goal. Close enough, at least, to know exactly how far away you really are.
0:17Williams throwing, and it's caught for the touchdown by DJ Moore!
0:20The Bears win it! For years now, the Packers have been sitting at 90%.
0:25Just dangerous enough to be a threat in September, but just deficient enough to go home in January.
0:31The talent is still there, just like it's always been.
0:34Great quarterback, great coach, great weapons, and when healthy, not one, not two, but three of the most dangerous hunters in the sport.
0:41On paper, they've got all the pieces. But there's something funny about 90%.
0:45When you finally reach that incredibly lofty standard, that's the moment you realize you're only halfway there.
0:51Welcome to the Bootleg Football Podcast. I'm Brett Coleman, that's EJ Snyder, and this is an extremely rare episode.
0:57I think this is the first time in the history of the show, and we've been going for six years at this
1:04point, that we are doing a Packers episode coming off a playoff loss to the Chicago Bears.
1:09Brand new territory, EJ. I don't know what to do with my hands.
1:13Yeah, you shouldn't. I don't think Packers fans do either, and they might have to get used to it, but they also might not.
1:21We're going to talk about all of it today, but I get to debut a brand new shirt because there is one
1:28thing I will not do on this podcast. I will wear shirts from lots of teams.
1:33I do for all the other episodes. I am not going to don Packers gear.
1:38However, every year I do endeavor to get something in their colors, and Woodinville came through with this beautiful plaid shirt when
1:45I was up there at the distillery, and I said, I got to have that.
1:50And strangely enough, their tasting room manager is a Packers fan.
1:53So he was like, hey, all right, I get to see our shirt for my team.
1:58And I was like, I will wear it in your honor.
2:02That's what we're doing for the Packers episode. But it's a fun team to talk about regardless of my Bears fandom because Matt LeFleur is a great coach.
2:11Jordan Love is a great quarterback. We're doing this on the day that the quarterback rankings dropped, which is pure summer rage bait.
2:18Which, by the way, pure summer rage bait. Awful.
2:21Yeah, exactly. That's what they want you to say.
2:24Like, they just want you to... Not the aggregate.
2:27I mean, the aggregate I thought was like, okay, you know, we're giving love to Dak.
2:32We're giving love to Stafford. Some of these guys like had Lamar like ninth.
2:36Which, even if we're just going off tiers, not straight rankings.
2:40You and I talked about this a little while ago.
2:43How we really rank in tiers and groups. We don't rank like straight one through ten or whatever.
2:48Lamar's not nine. What are we doing? And then, of course, there's the Bears versus Packers thing.
2:54Because Caleb, I think, was ranked over love. Even though, you know, same tier to me.
2:59I don't necessarily care that much. But if you're a Bears or a Packers fan, you really care if they're ranked one over the other.
3:07Yeah. It was a messy day on Twitter, EJ.
3:10Very messy day. And that's what they're looking for.
3:13They're looking for engagement. They do it to make people angry.
3:16It is not ball-knower. It is not based on things that we think really matter for football.
3:22It is purely to drum up interest in the middle of the summer and make people upset and jump online and talk about their team.
3:30And a lot of people did, to your point.
3:32But bottom line for today is if you don't have Jordan Love in the top ten quarterbacks in the NFL, I'm going to question your rankings.
3:41It's just not correct. He plays on hard mode.
3:44He does everything what Fleur asked him to do.
3:46And he does it at a very high level.
3:49So if he's not in your top ten, we're going to talk about who else is in there and whether or not
3:56we think how they stack up to Jordan Love.
3:59And we're certainly going to do that today for you, Packers fans.
4:03But we're going to talk about what went wrong in 2025.
4:07We're going to spend a ton of time on that, what the changes are for 2026, including some staff turnover, and what
4:14we think the outlook for this team is at the end based on ceiling and floor.
4:19If they hit all the green lights or if they trip over their own shoelaces again.
4:24I mean, let's be honest. What went wrong in 2025 was they had devastating injuries to two of their three best players.
4:31And they had some questionable coaching decisions from Matt LaFleur.
4:34Again, we are a pro Matt LaFleur podcast, but like we call it, like we see it.
4:39Yeah, buddy. It's like we had criticisms of Jordan Love a few years ago.
4:44We're going to criticize Matt LaFleur for not just taking the points at the worst possible opportunities.
4:49And they let inferior teams hang around and sometimes they got beat and sometimes they barely pulled it out of their ass.
4:56But, you know, they're crushing losses, which they had several this year.
5:00They were a difference of like three plays, even with their injuries.
5:04And those three plays a lot of the time fell on Matt LaFleur.
5:08Yeah, there's no doubt. And when you talk about how difficult the NFC North division was last year, best division in football,
5:15what separated the bottom three teams was a tie.
5:18Literally, the bottom two teams were on a tiebreaker at nine and eight.
5:22And the only reason the Packers were second and not third or fourth was because they were nine, seven and one.
5:29They only had seven losses, not eight. They had the same number of wins as the third and fourth place team, but they ended up coming in second.
5:38And they very well could have come in first again if they'd finished stronger.
5:42So nine, seven and one earned them the second rank in this tough division.
5:47Home record of five and three on the road.
5:49They were four, four and one the aforementioned tie.
5:52But over the last five games is really what I want to focus on with the Packers, because had they had this
5:59played out differently, and the Packers fans understand this deeply and perhaps emotionally, they would have been in a very different spot
6:06heading into the playoffs and would have had a much better seed and probably would have played more football last year.
6:13They were one and four down the stretch. That's after Micah got hurt.
6:17Obviously, Tucker Craft had been hurt for a couple of weeks when that slide started.
6:22Compared to the Vikings, who we talked about yesterday and finished five and oh in their final five games to make it
6:29to that nine wins, the Packers only managed one win in their last five.
6:33Team went out on an absolute skid, ended up having to head back to Chicago, as you mentioned in the open.
6:40Did not go well for them. Just couldn't hold on to it.
6:44So a fascinating division in that it was so tight down the stretch, but again, everybody came a different way to get
6:51there, and the Packers ended up on the short end of the stick.
6:55And it wasn't just injuries. Yes, injuries largely played a role, but to your point, in critical situations, they didn't always pull the right lever.
7:03And we had talked about it so many times throughout the season, right?
7:07They have low possession counts by design. The only team that had fewer possessions per game was Carolina, and it was like a difference of 0.1 per game.
7:16They were both sub 10, which means a significant chunk of their games.
7:20They really only had nine possessions, which really means they had maybe seven.
7:24If you count kneel downs, like end of halves and everything like that.
7:28So if you're giving yourself only seven to eight real opportunities to score, nine or 10 on a eventful day, it means you have to be perfect.
7:37And you look at the Bears loss in the regular season, not the playoff loss, which made them be the seventh seed
7:44in the first place and have to go to Chicago rather than having to go to Philly.
7:49You look at the game that they lost to Cleveland.
7:53You look at the Arizona game, which was really tight, right?
7:56They were down by seven going into the fourth quarter in that game, ended up having to score late to pull it out.
8:03You know, I look at even the Commanders game, like they dominated on paper, but like they should have won by even more than they did.
8:12This team allowed inferior ball clubs to hang around and in a couple of very inopportune moments, let them win because they played a very high variance style.
8:21Like they tried to be a very ball control heavy team.
8:24But if you're not scoring at a high enough rate on your few possessions, you're going to let bad teams stay with you.
8:32And we have some numbers behind that, by the way, they had specifically on the first drive, right?
8:37First drive always sets the tone for the game.
8:40Like, what do you want to be? We're going to see what teams prefer to be on the first drive.
8:46First drive average play clock remaining when the ball is snapped 7.2 seconds.
8:51That was the fourth least amount of remaining play clock per snap of any team in the league, right?
8:57They were always grinding the clock down, snapping it as late as possible, even on the first drive of the game, because they wanted to eat clock, right?
9:06If they could take half the first quarter with their first drive, that's what they were going to do.
9:12They averaged just under eight plays per opening drive.
9:15Only two teams had more than that, which was Cincy and the Rams, doing it by different methods, because Cincy and LA
9:22had very different styles of offenses, but they were really good at mounting opening drives.
9:26And so you would think, okay, taking a bunch of time off the clock, having these long, crushing opening drives, they probably
9:33started with leads most of the time. They actually didn't.
9:36They were 21st in scoring drive percentage on their opening drive, despite averaging like eight plays per opening drive, which sounds impossible.
9:44Like, how are you that bad at scoring despite holding the ball?
9:47And it's because nearly one in five opening drives for them ended with a turnover on downs, even while being deep in enemy territory.
9:55That is simply unacceptable. You can't have that many turnovers on downs while calling yourself an elite offense, right?
10:01You have to be able to get points in those high leverage situations.
10:05Or if your whole plan is to not have that many more opportunities to score for the rest of the game anyway,
10:12Matt, take the points when you are there, right?
10:15This team had a supreme confidence in their ability to have their cake and eat it too, right?
10:21We're going to limit the number of possessions per game, and we're going to score on like five out of eight of them in any given week.
10:29It's an almost impossible standard to set yourself to.
10:32While also, by the way, Christian Watson misses seven games.
10:35Tucker Kraft goes out like halfway through the year.
10:38Your offensive line is in the mid-20s in pressure rate allowed because they were taking on injuries as well, and they were
10:45not the typical Green Bay offense we're looking at, right?
10:48They were also in the mid-20s in terms of average yards before contact per attempt generated in the ground game.
10:55They weren't as good of a ground game as we're used to.
10:59And yet they still had this confidence of like, yeah, we can score anytime we want to, so we're going to go
11:06for it on the opening drive, and we're going to risk not taking points in one of the few opportunities we get to take points.
11:14Three of those games, the Arizona game, which they barely won, the Commanders game, which they did win handily, and the Bears
11:21game, which they lost, which made them the seven seed, all had opening drive turnovers on downs.
11:26So that's what I'm talking about when I say it's partly Matt LaFleur not understanding the limitations of his team.
11:32If you get inside the 30, take the points.
11:35Like you have a very good offense despite your injuries, despite your offensive line problems, despite your run game being hot and
11:42cold, despite your receivers being injured because you have Jordan Love.
11:46Do not waste his effort. Do not waste his ability to dig you out of a hole by tempting fate and not
11:53just getting a field goal, getting three points, right?
11:56This team wasn't good enough to take that kind of risk, especially because they weren't giving themselves that many opportunities to score again anyway by design.
12:04So I don't know, man. I think this offense needed the reality check, and I would hope this season that they either
12:11A, pick up the pace, give themselves more plays, give themselves more drives, or B, don't...
12:16There's a difference between being aggressive and being cute.
12:19I would like for them to still be aggressive, but not be cute.
12:23And those lessons were unfortunately learned the hard way in 2025.
12:27Yeah. You've got a great offense. Bring it to bear more often.
12:30And it's been predicted, and I believe that tempo is going to be one of the sort of overriding themes of the 2026 NFL season.
12:38We're going to see more teams using more tempo to get more bites at the apple.
12:43Because, again, you have an elite weapon in Jordan Love.
12:47He is surrounded with skill position players that can absolutely pay it off.
12:51Give yourself more chances to do that. And, you know, again, we've got numbers to back that up.
12:57The how they got to that record is what we call bootleg power score.
13:01It's six numbers that we think are really key to a football team being good at football.
13:06All passing EPA per play, rushing EPA per play, defense against the run on a pass, again, defined by EPA per play.
13:13Points scored and points allowed. Those are six numbers.
13:16We assign their league rank. Where did they finish?
13:19Add those numbers up, divide by six. We get a raw score.
13:23And then we rank those scores, and that is their power score.
13:27So their passing EPA per play was elite. We'll talk about why that number doesn't add up to the number of points scored.
13:34You already alluded to it. They were second in the league for passing EPA per play.
13:39When I say elite, I am talking about a top two passing offense based on that metric in the NFL.
13:46Rushing EPA per play was 18th. Might sound low, but middle of the road rushing attacks are plenty to get you the
13:53points you need and win you games in the NFL, especially if you're efficient.
13:57Like you said, they were efficient sometimes, but not all the time.
14:01But 18th ranked rushing attack is not a death knell in the modern NFL.
14:05Against the pass, they were 21st. That was also hot and cold and also had a lot to do with them putting
14:12all their hopes on Micah's shoulders and him not being available for some of their games.
14:17Rush EPA per play allowed, 19th. Not great. They struggled to stop the run, but it wasn't, again, the dagger in the heart.
14:25Points scored, they were 16th right down the middle.
14:28Points allowed, they were very good scoring defense. They were 11th in the NFL.
14:32If you add all those up, their raw score is 14.5.
14:36That tied them with Detroit, but in tiebreakers, they won.
14:39So they are the 13th most powerful team based on bootleg power score.
14:43Again, just outside the top 10. And we can see the reasons, but when you look at the second-ranked passing attack, passing
14:50attack being the preeminent part of offense and the one that most often leads you to points in the modern NFL, and
14:57then you look at their points scored, second EPA passing attack, 16th in points scored.
15:02Like, the math's not mathing. But that's the difference, right?
15:05Expected is what you should do. Right. Like, what we expect you to do.
15:09And then there's the actual points. Like, that metric is everything I was talking about.
15:14Mm-hmm. Right? They would hit a big passing play, they would get in a field goal range, and then they would get
15:21cute, go for it on fourth down, wouldn't work out.
15:24So all those expected points, like, you know, it's kind of like how, you know, it's like, oh, I can't be paid
15:31in exposure because exposure doesn't pay my rent. I don't win based on expected points.
15:36I win based on points. And we got into an area where we expect to at least get three, and we got zero, Matt.
15:44So it's the same kind of issues that, like, Detroit's had in the past where it's like, you know, we're going to go for it no matter what.
15:53We're going to be aggressive. And, like, there were so many drives where it's like, Dan, calm down.
15:58Like, just kick the ball. Like, we think you're going to be back in position to score again.
16:04Just take the freaking points. I feel like it's not like people have been, like, analytics pilled, but I feel like some
16:11teams have gotten way too loosey-goosey with a very limited number.
16:15Because even the teams that have a lot of possessions per game, we're talking about, like, 11 to 12, right?
16:21So they have two more possessions than the Packers do on average per game.
16:25You don't get 14 in a typical NFL game.
16:28And if an elite scoring drive percentage is, like, 55%, 60%, if you're, like, ridiculous.
16:33So, you know, go 11 possessions. You're going to score six times.
16:37If you throw away two of those, you're going to score four.
16:41Not all of those are going to be touchdowns.
16:44So now you're looking at two touchdowns, two field goals in a game.
16:48So you're scoring 20 when you could have been scoring 26.
16:51What's the difference between 20 and 26 points per game?
16:54Probably a significant chunk of rankings. So that's when we talk about where it's, like, EPA is great.
17:00It shows that you have the capability to score.
17:03Actual points is what wins you games. And they just refused to take the points.
17:08And it infuriated me. To your point, hopefully lesson learned and adjustments made.
17:12Obviously, we'll talk about some of the personnel adjustments.
17:15But that's a coaching adjustment. That is a, with this personnel I have on the field deployed, I am going to choose some of the time.
17:23Again, we're not saying don't be aggressive. We're not saying always kick the field goal.
17:28Well, it is the alchemy of being a head coach, or in this case, a play caller.
17:33And knowing when to pull that lever, when you can get the points, when you really shouldn't push for more points.
17:40Because if you don't get them, the negative of not having them outweighs the likelihood that you might get the three.
17:47Because you're not going to get the three every time.
17:50We're assuming it's field goal range, right? You're going to miss some field goals, but at a lower percentage than those drives that end up in zero.
17:58And to your point, the difference of six points a game in the NFL is worth several wins per year.
18:05And wins per year is the metric you're looking for.
18:08And you also have to look at the cascading effect of when you're coming off a drive where you score.
18:14It does, like, there are studies that are done on it.
18:18It does affect run pass rates for the other team.
18:21If they're trying to respond to points. And if you're a better pass defense than a run defense, which when they had
18:28Micah, like, very few teams can block Micah. If you're affecting run pass rates and you're putting them into a higher pass
18:35rate because you're just constantly taking blocks out of the Jenga tower and saying, go ahead, take one, block Micah, the nastiest Jenga block that we've got.
18:44I don't know if the metaphor holds up, but you know what I'm talking about.
18:48Like, if you just keep adding that pressure of, like, you have to respond to points, it's going to affect run pass rates.
18:56If you're not scoring, they can run the ball more.
18:59Like, they're not going to feel as much pressure.
19:02Like, even three points, it will put pressure on play callers.
19:05Like, there's a tangible effect on run pass rates.
19:08So, I don't know. If you have that kind of super weapon on defense, you have Edge Cooper, you have Xavier McKinney,
19:15you have Jeff Halfley as a DC who schemes up, like, truly brilliant pass defenses sometimes, even with limited resources.
19:22I don't understand why I would ever put those guys at a disadvantage by not giving them that kind of buffer.
19:28So, you know, hopefully they learn from it. We'll see.
19:31I do want to bring up the change in DC, by the way.
19:36Like, we will get to it more in the coaching section, but I think now is a good time to bring up
19:43Jonathan Gannon taking over for Jeff Halfley. And, you know, what was Halfley's style and what is Gannon's style?
19:49We talked about Halfley a lot in the Dolphins episode and the influences that I think he's going to bring to Miami's defense, where it's very rotation heavy.
19:58You know, they were a more cover three heavy team than you would expect, but they would do it from a two
20:05high pre-snap presentation and then roll down into cover three.
20:08Like, that was kind of their calling card was starting out in two high and going into one high.
20:14Or sometimes they would start at one high, get into, like, all these funky different variations to cover two.
20:20It was always rotation. It was zone, zone, zone.
20:23The only time they ever played band was in third and medium, and they fucking sucked at it.
20:28So they really tried not to. You know, he would creatively use Micah as, like, a stack rusher over the center.
20:35And I felt like he was going to do the same thing with Chop Robinson.
20:40And, you know, that was the prevailing topic in the Dolphins episode.
20:44But now Packers fans are like, okay, is Jonathan Gannon going to do that?
20:48Because that's not a typical Fangio type of thing.
20:51And, you know, everybody associates Gannon with Fangio. Are we just going to be a quarters and quarter-quarter half team?
20:57Like, Fangio guys never run cover two. Are we just not going to run the cover two that works so well for us?
21:05You'll be happy to know Gannon actually departed from the Fangio-ness a lot last year.
21:10Arizona was a fairly cover two heavy team, relatively speaking.
21:13Difference is, they called it a lot on early downs, like specifically first down.
21:17They were a first down cover two team, which is odd.
21:21Most teams saved cover two for either like second and long or third down.
21:25They called it a lot on the first down.
21:28But the difference was, they did it with rotation, right?
21:31It wasn't a static cover two presentation. It wasn't like Minnesota where it's palms coverage, but with a fire zone attached.
21:38It was, they would show cover three and then back out and play cover two.
21:43Or they would show three high, like three high safeties pre-snap.
21:46And then have the one essentially be the same thing as a pole runner in Tampa two, but he would step down.
21:53And so they were very cover two heavy, but they didn't show you they were in cover two.
21:59They wanted to present like they were going to be trying to stop the run with a traditional cover three, try to
22:06get you to throw the ball on them on first down and then surprise it's cover two.
22:11I understand why he did that because it's sneaky and it's fun and it's deceptive.
22:16Here's the issue. They were really bad at it.
22:19Specifically, their linebackers. I respect Gannon for doing something fun.
22:22When you have Mack Wilson, Akeem Davis, Gaither and Cody Simon.
22:26I'm sorry. I, I don't want to do anything that makes those guys have to cover.
22:31And he made them have to cover. And they were really, really, really bad at it.
22:36Like really bad at it. I like almost unspeakably bad at it.
22:40So the idea was cool. The execution was terrible.
22:43You know, their corners last year had a missed tackle rate of almost 20%.
22:47I'm sorry. You can't play that much cover two with hard flats with corners that can't tackle.
22:52And I'm talking all Arizona corners couldn't tackle. I felt like the only guy on the defense that could tackle was Buddha.
22:59And even then Buddha still missed a bunch as well.
23:03So it's, it's one of those, like in theory, I liked what Gannon did.
23:07He did not have the personnel to do it.
23:10Like there was a couple times where like, oh, they did the thing, right?
23:14Like they, they got a sack on Darnold in one of the Seahawks games where they showed cover three and then Buddha
23:21peddled out of it and it was quarters. And you know, they handled the threat of the post and they cut the
23:28crossing route and Zayven was stacking on a tight end.
23:32And then he dropped and he picked up the running back going to the flat and Darnold's like, oh shit.
23:38And Sweat got a sack. And you're like, they did it.
23:42They did the thing. And then it was like five straight plays of garbage.
23:46And it happened once. Yeah. Like, no. Well, so I, I look at, I look at his fit with the Packers and I'm like, okay.
23:54Micah. Edge. Yeah. Insert Edge Cooper. McKinney. We have sung Edge Cooper's praises as one of the best and most athletic young linebackers in the league.
24:02And in terms of what he can do physically, specifically as a pole runner in Tampa too, not the NTT or non-traditional
24:09Tampa you're talking about, although they have safeties that can do that too.
24:13So I would not be at all surprised if Gannon runs that because again, he's got the personnel to run it from
24:20the secondary, but he's got linebackers who can cover specifically one of the best young, most explosive linebackers in the NFL.
24:27Great going forward, but also can run the rail.
24:30And given that, I would imagine the success rate of that call will be higher.
24:35We'll see what the frequency of that particular call is, but when it's called, if the success rate isn't higher, I'll pay a dollar.
24:42I can't imagine they wouldn't be better at it considering their personnel in Arizona.
24:47Yeah. Right. And you know, a lot of people have doubts about Gannon because of how the Arizona thing went, but like,
24:54I see the vision, like there is an actual vision here.
24:57They just weren't good. You can criticize Gannon for like, okay, well, why didn't he call stuff they were good at?
25:04I'm not sure there's any coverage you can call that Mack Wilson and Akeem Davis-Kath are going to be able to cover in.
25:11Like what you want to play cover one and man up on running backs.
25:16It's like, they couldn't do that either. So I call it a personnel issue more so in Arizona than I think a scheme issue.
25:23He does call fun stuff and you're going to see some funky shit in Green Bay this year.
25:29Like last year in Arizona, if you're looking at snaps where they showed cover three, where like Buddha showed he was going
25:36to be in the box and then peddled out of it and surprise its quarters.
25:41They did that more than three X the second place team.
25:44Like that was their thing. Show cover three surprises quarters.
25:48Again, didn't always work because the linebackers sucked, but it was cool.
25:51And so I just, I look at, I look at the tools he has to work with and I look at the
25:58ideas that he had and I don't just see Fangio copy paste.
26:02I see a really, really creative idea that could work pretty well.
26:06We'll see. Yeah. It's one of the cool things about either position coaches stepping up to coordinator level or coordinators stepping up
26:13to the head coach level where they are again, calling their traditional side of the ball.
26:18We'll call it. And you do get to see like how, how much are they going to adhere to their influences and
26:25how much are they going to add now that they have final say and can really be creative.
26:31And maybe they've been pushing that for two or three years.
26:34And the person they were working under has been saying, eh, we'll try it, but that's not really what we do.
26:41Now gloves are off. You could do whatever you want.
26:44And a lot of times, both on offense and defense, we see that coaches when they ascend do vary from their influences and it is fun.
26:53It is creative. And like you said, we're going to see some funky shit and that's cool.
26:58I do think he has the personnel to pay it off and bring back.
27:02Hi, alternate timeline, Brett here before we get to all the 2026 stuff.
27:07If you've liked a lot of the data that we brought up so far, we have companion infographics for every single team,
27:14including the one we're talking about today with over 15,000, total data points that we've collected throughout this summer.
27:20Each team gets its own companion infographic, which is roughly about 20 pages long.
27:24It has all the data on this team you can think of, whether it's alignment data, personnel data, cap allocation, coverage data
27:31broken out by down and distance, blitz data. I mean, basically anything you can think of, we've got it.
27:37So if you want access to that, you can find that down at the link in the description below or at the QR code on the screen.
27:46A reminder, we also have bonus episodes that go live every single Friday over on Patreon, recapping every single division.
27:52We're going to pick division winners, MVPs, rookies of the year, all that stuff.
27:57So if you want bonus episodes plus more data that you could probably handle, that is over on the Patreon.
28:03Thank you once again to all of our patrons that have made, honestly, this series possible to make in the first place.
28:10We could not have paid the people who help us make it without your guys' financial support.
28:15So thank you to our patrons. Thank you to all of our executive producers on Patreon.
28:21Their names are on screen right now. They have been OG supporters of us and made so much in our lives possible
28:28while we try to chase this dream. So thank you.
28:31Thank you. Thank you. And with that, let's get back to the show.
28:35Well, EJ, I saw Luke Getze's name was in the following segment.
28:39So it's not Brandy. So it's not a true Wisconsin episode.
28:42It's bourbon. I should have poured Brandy. Well, this is rye for me.
28:46I went rye. Nope. But, you know, Woodinville, if you're watching, you guys probably could make a killer Brandy if you want
28:53to invade the Wisconsin market a little bit. Yeah, I'm sure they could.
28:57And I would absolutely consume that because, again, all the stuff that Woodinville makes is quality.
29:03And they're one of the few distilleries that I will try anything they make.
29:07Even if I don't necessarily like the style, I'll try it because I know it's crafted with care and really cool ingredients.
29:14Again, almost 100% of their ingredients come from Washington, which is really cool.
29:18So if they tried Brandy, good on them. I would absolutely have glass.
29:22Sounds like a wonderful winter drink. But moving to the power structure for Green Bay.
29:27Speaking of winter segues, the GM, Brian Gutekunst, been there a while.
29:31And again, Packers fans, I think Gutekunst is a guy that they love to hate.
29:36They love him when he does things like Paul Mike and they love to hate him when he doesn't get the wide receivers that they want.
29:44I think that's all GMs. But overall, we just talked about it.
29:48Gannon is now inheriting a roster on the defensive side that has more tools than the one he came from in Arizona.
29:55Gutekunst has done a good job of stocking the roster in Green Bay.
29:59At the top level, and we will talk about this, this team is a glass cannon.
30:04And a lot of times that is a backhanded compliment, meaning they're really good if they're healthy, but they're brittle.
30:10And if they break, they're not any good. I feel like we need to list Green Bay as glass cannon with glass
30:17in lowercase letters and cannon in uppercase. Because when the front line of this team is healthy, they are as dangerous as
30:24any team in the NFC, which is the most powerful conference in the National Football League right now.
30:30They can hang with anybody when love is healthy, when Mike is healthy, when Christian Watson is healthy.
30:36Well, that top level of talent in Green Bay is inarguably one of the better rosters in the NFL.
30:42The problem comes when you just scratch the surface and go a little bit deeper in the secondary or on the defensive line or in the receiver room.
30:51Um, we'll talk about that depth, but that is the Achilles heel of this team.
30:56It bit them last year. Again, if they can stay healthy, this team is as dangerous as any team in the NFC.
31:03As you go down the line, a big reason for that is their head coach, Matt LaFleur.
31:08Yes, we're nitpicking in the opening about game management decisions, because again, we're going to call it like we see it.
31:15When you do a dumb thing, Matt, we're going to bring it up.
31:19You also do a lot of brilliant things. The reason you were number two at EPA in the NFL is because when
31:26it's functioning and things are working as you want them to, you are brilliant at it.
31:31And we have sung your praises many times on this podcast because of it.
31:35When Matt LaFleur and Jordan Love are in sync, this team can hang with anybody.
31:40And that is not something that every team in the NFL can say.
31:44That is a rare combination of play caller and the guy executing those plays on the field.
31:50And again, Green Bay at the top level has that.
31:53And it's one of the reasons they're one of the most dangerous teams in the league.
31:58Now it's time for the Luke Getze of it all, which yes, I saw that name too.
32:03And yes, I've had my bourbon so I can talk about it rationally at this point.
32:09Fucking jump scare when I opened the dock today.
32:11I was like, no, no. Him and Shane. He's back.
32:15Him and Shane Waldron, man. Like Luke Getze and Shane Waldron.
32:18Shane Waldron just got promoted too. And I'm like, what are we doing?
32:22But again, one of the good things about Gannon to get back to him is like now he doesn't have head coach responsibilities either.
32:30That's always an extra draw on guys. And when they get to sort of revert to what got them the job in
32:37the first place, I kind of like that situation for a lot of them because a lot of guys are just better coordinators.
32:44It's not a backhanded compliment. It's not a, you know, it's not a downturn for them.
32:49It's, hey, that's their best life, their best role where they're happiest and most effective.
32:54And I feel like that might be the case for Gannon.
32:58But getting back to Getze, this team's interesting in the fact that they have two assistant head coach titles.
33:04They have one for offense and one for defense, which is how I think they probably get around that because usually one
33:11is an associate head coach and one is an assistant.
33:14I think assistant is higher than associate when you're talking about salary levels and everything else.
33:19But this team has two assistant head coaches, one for offense, who is the aforementioned Luke Getze.
33:24His position responsibility is quarterbacks. The assistant head coach for defense has possibly the longest title in the NFL.
33:30Assistant head coach for defense, outside linebackers and defensive run game coordinator.
33:34That is Demarcus Covington. That man's got more plaques on his door than he has door space.
33:40Responsible for a lot of stuff in this defense.
33:43The offense coordinator, I would say in name only is Adam Stenevich.
33:46He is LeFleur's helper and should be in line for future opportunities given the high profile of Green Bay's offense.
33:53But it's kind of a double-edged sword. A lot of people will look at Green Bay's offense and say, oh yeah, but it's all LeFleur.
34:01Like how much is Adam really doing? And he's going to get some of those interviews, but it can work against you
34:08as well when you're working under a guy like Sean McVay, which McVay is not a great example because he's put as
34:15many offensive assistants in higher positions around the league as any head coach going.
34:19But we'll see if that, how that plays out for Adam Stenevich.
34:23Defensive coordinator, Jonathan Gannon. We've spoken at length about him.
34:26And then the special teams coordinator is Cam. I think it's Acord or Accord, but you can tell me in the comments which is the proper pronunciation.
34:35I believe it's Acord. He's replacing Rich Passaccia. I will say his number one objective this year is just make the kickers better, right?
34:42Because McManus was not good. I will say this.
34:45I forgot to give context to Matt LeFleur's decisions, which I still disagree with overall.
34:50But there is some context to him not taking the points, and that's that in 40 to 49 yard field goals last
34:57year, McManus made 44% of them, which is not good.
35:00So maybe he thought, OK, well, we have a better than 44% chance of converting this.
35:05So let's do that. But, you know, that's a separate issue of why did you go into the season with a kicker
35:12that can't make a 45 yarder, Matt? Yeah. And or Goody.
35:16And or Basaccia. Basaccia, right? The brain trust in general.
35:19Why are you trusting a kicker in what is the money range in the NFL?
35:24Whenever I'm scouting kickers, and as you all know, that's very briefly every year, if at all.
35:29The only thing I'm interested in, if I'm looking at a college kicker coming out, is what were they from 40 to 49?
35:37I don't care about their overall numbers. I don't care about how many 60 yarders they made, if any.
35:43The chances you're going to get the opportunity to pay those off in the NFL, very low.
35:48Might it be a game winning field goal? Probably.
35:51That's the only chance you're going to get to kick one of those.
35:55Money made in the NFL for kickers is 40 to 49.
35:59It reminds me very much, especially with the extension of range we've seen for kickers over recent years of the golfing adage, right?
36:06Drive for show, putt for dough. If you're putting for dough, it's 40 to 49.
36:11You've got to make those kicks. That is money.
36:14Your team, your head coach is expecting you to make those kicks.
36:17And if you're making less than half of them, guess what?
36:21You're not going to be employed the following year.
36:24Especially when they were 57%, which is still compared to the best kicker in the league, that's still not good.
36:30But you're better from 50 than you are from 43?
36:33Yeah. It's so weird. So, so weird. So, again, I could understand Matt having that trepidation and just going for it because he didn't trust his kicker.
36:42But that's a totally separate criticism of like, well, then get a new kicker.
36:46Right. I don't know. Completely agree. Assistant coaches, we're going to start off the offensive line.
36:51Luke Butkus. Yes, he is related to Dick Butkus.
36:54And he's also pretty damn good at his job.
36:57Green Bay offensive line, to me as a Bears fan, is always annoying.
37:01They always have a bunch of players you look at and go, oh, there could be a weakness there.
37:07And then they play really well. You know, a given health, of course.
37:11But Luke Butkus has done an admirable job with his offensive line.
37:15The pass game coordinator is Jason Vrabel. And no, he is not related to Mike Vrabel.
37:20Different spelling, different guy. So Butkus, yes. Vrabel, no.
37:23Jason Vrabel has been with Green Bay since 2019, became the wide receivers coach in 2020.
37:28And then the pass game coordinator in 22. Yes, not related to one Mike Vrabel.
37:33Different spelling, interestingly enough, on the last name. All right.
37:36You said you got a jump scare. Here it is.
37:39Cornerbacks coach, Daniel Bullocks. Entering his 11th season coaching.
37:42How is that possible? Like, I remember scouting Daniel Bullocks as a player.
37:47I remember him as a player in the league.
37:49I read that 11th year as a coach. I was like, no.
37:53Yes, it's true. We're just old. I am getting older.
37:56Just old every day. But that was my job.
37:59Trace McSorley is a coach now. He was just at Penn State a week ago.
38:04True story. The secondary coach and defensive pass game coordinator is Bobby Babich.
38:08Yes, that is the son of Bob Babich. A longtime linebackers coach for the Bears and others.
38:14So lots of NFL bloodlines on this assistant coaching staff.
38:17And then the defensive line coach, Vincent Ogobase. I want to bring him up because he was on Halfley's staff at Boston College.
38:24He came over when Halfley came to the Packers.
38:27He mentored Azraku at Boston College. He was his position coach while he was there before Azraku got drafted by the Cowboys.
38:34So interestingly enough, he is the guy that's going to be tasked with not only, I don't really want to say coaching
38:41Micah because Micah is a transcendent talent and the defensive coordinator is going to be responsible for moving him around.
38:47But getting complimentary pieces around Micah so that that pass rush doesn't necessarily fall off when he's not in the game or has other responsibilities.
38:55Because one of the great things about Micah is he's athletic enough.
38:59You can drop him in coverage. You can do all kinds of wild card things with him.
39:05But that, of course, means... I'm sorry. If you drop Micah in coverage, you're an asshole.
39:10I'm sorry. Like, straight up. Just... Okay. I'll say this.
39:13Jonathan Gannon, the one criticism I had. I saw a play last year where they dropped Josh Sweat in coverage.
39:19What the fuck are we doing? Again... Why is he 25 yards down the field?
39:24If you do that with Micah, you're an asshole.
39:27I'm sorry. All right. Let him rush. Yeah, let him rush.
39:30Go forward. But Vincent's the guy who is tasked with combining all the pieces on that offensive line.
39:36Again, oftentimes with defensive line, just like quarterback, we focus on one guy.
39:40The top guy, Micah. And we say, it's Micah or Bust.
39:44Well, there are four, five, six other guys in that rotation that are also going to have to be productive.
39:50And that falls on Vincent's plate. I'm really curious to see what he does with Dennis Sutton.
39:56Who... Again, another one of these Penn State guys who comes out, tests really well.
40:00I didn't think he looked as athletic on tape as he tested.
40:04Like, he put up a really good three cone.
40:07I'm like... What? Yeah. He didn't bend like that on tape.
40:10Where was that? Yeah. Trained for the drill really well.
40:14But, like, there are tools there. I think he's got power.
40:17He's got length to him. You know, if he can turn him into something, if he can work with Brenton Cox, who
40:24I thought, you know, flashed a little bit in college as well as not last year, but the year before that.
40:31I mean, even Carl Brooks has had his... Like, there's guys there you can work with.
40:36You can kind of Voltron together a rotation here around Micah.
40:39I'm still not really sure what Lucas Van Ness is going to be, but like, there's talent there.
40:45So, I don't know. Like, they could be a good pass rush.
40:49Could be. It's hyper-reliant on Micah being Micah. But if you squint, you could see it.
40:54Yeah, it's possible. And it's also going to be necessary because it's a great segue into the free agency recap because there
41:01were a lot of losses on the defensive line in Green Bay this year.
41:06You know, this team was pretty up against it financially, right?
41:09And some of these departures kind of reflect that, right?
41:12I'm going to raise my hand at this point because I had some very heated debates with Packers fans in the middle
41:19of the year when we said on Bear Era, my other podcast, I said, there is basically no reality where the Packers
41:26can keep Elton Jenkins and Rashawn Gary. And I got shouted down.
41:30And I was like, you and I talked about this.
41:33We actually ended up talking about it on bootleg because of that conversation and the response.
41:38And people, especially Green Bay fans, got to call you out for this, were like, oh, no, you're wrong.
41:44They can keep them both. And I was like, in no world.
41:48Well, they didn't want to. They weren't even good enough to justify keeping.
41:52Like, you shouldn't have wanted to keep them. The fact that they got to trade Rashawn Gary.
41:58It's like, you got a fourth round pick for Rashawn Gary?
42:01You got to get out of jail free card.
42:04Yeah, for sure. But there were, again, Packers fans and there are these fans in all fan bases.
42:10This is not specific to Packers fandom who were like, you're an idiot.
42:14They're keeping both of those guys. And I was like, OK, first off, financially, there's no way for them to keep them
42:21both without gutting the rest of the team, which would be a terrible decision to your point.
42:26They could, again, put themselves over a barrel to keep one of them.
42:31But I don't think they're going to keep either of them.
42:34I think they're both gone, and I got told I was an absolute idiot.
42:39In the wash, Elgin Jenkins, Rashawn Gary, no longer being paid by Packers.
42:43But Colby Wooden's not there either. You know, Diggs, we didn't expect to be a long-term piece.
42:48That's fine. But Malik Willis, we also didn't expect him to be there long-term either, because why would they pay him a
42:55bunch of money to be a backup quarterback when he's a starting caliber quarterback and he got paid like a starting caliber quarterback?
43:02He got $22.5 million from Miami. And I think they were, honestly, they were proud of him for that.
43:09Like, cool, this is going to help us actually get free agent quarterbacks that we can develop and then turn that into opportunities for them.
43:16Like Malik Willis' success is a recruiting pitch for Green Bay, quite honestly.
43:21So I think they were happy to see that.
43:23But there was no universe where they were going to keep him.
43:27Wicks was an interesting one for me. Yeah, I wasn't sure they were going to trade him, but they ended up trading
43:34him to the Eagles who were, you know, shopping for another wide receiver three.
43:39But Enigbari, I thought there was a 50-50 shot they were going to keep him.
43:44He's now with the Jets. Rasheed Walker was an interesting one.
43:47I thought they couldn't keep him, but I also thought he was going to get a way bigger number than he got.
43:54And then he ended up getting $4 million from Carolina.
43:57I was like, well, shit, they could have done that.
44:00But whatever, just wasn't in their plans. It is what it is.
44:04Dubs went to New England for $17 million. No way they could afford that.
44:09Quay Walker, $13.5. No way they could afford that.
44:12Emmanuel Wilson, you know, $1.5. They probably could have afforded that, but they like their other backs.
44:17Like, they're still waiting for Marshawn Lloyd to be a thing.
44:20Brought in the UDFA we'll talk about. But, you know, at least four or five of those guys, there was just no
44:28way with their cap space going into March they could keep.
44:31And that's part of the reason why I'm a little bit worried about the first half of their season because Micah's still coming off an injury.
44:39Tucker's still coming off an injury. And the roster, while still good, to your point, it got thinned out a little bit over this offseason.
44:47And that was necessary just because of, you know, how much their star power costs.
44:52Yeah, it is about those game-changing players. And you see it on both sides of the ball, maybe more starkly than any other team in the league.
45:01When Christian Watson, who we'll talk about, you know, in terms of the resignings, is on the field, Green Bay is a completely different offense.
45:09We've got some numbers to back that up. When Micah is on the field for their defense, nobody can block him.
45:15When those two guys aren't on the field, the offense and the defense look very, very different.
45:21First off, if I was a GM and I saw Rasheed Walker available for $4 million and I needed to tackle three,
45:28I would be sprinting to the phone. I think that's a tremendous value.
45:32And Emmanuel Wilson, also a great value. Not a big name.
45:35Strangely enough, we were talking about a Wilson yesterday in the Vikings episode, who is also underrated.
45:41But Emmanuel Wilson ran the ball very strongly for Green Bay when he got the chance.
45:46Was in on over 30% of their snaps. Is still only 27.
45:50Seahawks get a very good runner for under $1.6 million.
45:53So, really good values. In terms of the resignings, I could say it's headlined by Bo Melton, but I'm not going to do that.
46:01I'll let you talk about him. Yeah, Travis Hunter, eat your heart out.
46:05Wide receiver one and CB1. Let's go. Right. Let's talk about it.
46:08Oh, boy. No, Christian Watson is the highlight here.
46:11$23 million. They needed to resign him. We will talk about that in depth, but I'll go through the rest of the resignings first.
46:19Not all of them. We'll put those up on screen.
46:22But the keys are Jaden Reed at 16.7. I like Jaden Reed as a player.
46:27I will say this. I like Jaden Reed as a wide receiver.
46:31I think he is good. To see him at 16.7 and Christian Watson only at 23.
46:36It's one of those vagaries of the wide receiver market and agent workings and how they both got it done.
46:42There is a bigger difference than that between them as players.
46:46It's a good value for Reed. I think it's also a good value for Watson, but I think Reed probably could have got a little bit more.
46:54And Watson could have got a little bit more health notwithstanding.
46:58Sean Ryan and Darian Kennard, both signings along the offensive line.
47:01Sean Ryan is going to be the starting center.
47:04We'll see how that goes. Kennard, a valuable backup at tackle.
47:08And then I'll let you talk about the Bo Melton of it all before we talk about Christian Watson and his particular impact on this team.
47:16Well, Melton at 1.1 million is just a great player for the room because he earns his roster spot by just being down for whatever.
47:24Right? Like you need an emergency DB, he can do it.
47:27You need an emergency receiver, he can do it.
47:30But he'll play special teams like he's 1.1 million for a roster spot that will just do whatever.
47:36I'm not saying he's great at anything at the moment, even though he's number one in your hearts and minds, Packers fans.
47:43But I don't know. I think having a guy who could be your CB5 or wide receiver 5 is worth 1.1 million.
47:50I'll say that. As for Christian Watson, I think when the deal first came out, it was reported as like $28 million a year.
47:58And now it's at, you know, the real money I think is $23 million.
48:02He is undeniably their most impactful weapon. As in, you know, I pulled this stat from Mockingboard, which is in games where
48:09he has a target, they're the number one pass EPA in the league.
48:13Now, overall they're number two, but that includes the games where he made them number one.
48:18But in the games where he's not there, depending on which EPA formulations you're using, he'll be anywhere, the Packers will be anywhere between fourth and ninth.
48:27So Watson being on the field gets them from being ninth to first, right?
48:31And one of the themes of this episode is, you know, the best part about being 90% is, you know, you're halfway there.
48:39If he can get you the other half of the way there to being the most efficient, most explosive passing offense in the NFL, that's worth $23 million.
48:48Even though he does have a well-documented history of injuries.
48:51I mean, he missed seven games last year. You know, he's ideally fixed the hamstring issues by kind of relearning how to run.
48:58And there were some stories about that as well.
49:01Like we'll see going forward if he stays healthy this year.
49:05But the reason why he was, you know, 23 or 28 million, whatever the number was compared to 35 million is solely because of the durability concerns.
49:13But when he's on the field, he produces the value of a $35 million receiver.
49:18So I like the signing from that standpoint. I'm worried about it, obviously.
49:22Why wouldn't I be? But from an impact standpoint, I think it makes sense.
49:27And let's just say it's a slight overpay because of durability.
49:30Like let's say he still misses games and you're like, God, why are we paying this much money for a guy?
49:37If him being on the field for the games that he is on the field makes your $55 million quarterback play like
49:44a $60 million quarterback and opens up enough space for your future $20 million tight end to play like a $25 million tight end.
49:51If I kind of just girl math this thing in my head and I play with calorie counting here, I can justify that, right?
49:59Because his impact isn't just him making plays, but it's the space that the threat of him opens up for everybody else.
50:06You know, he makes Jordan Love a better player.
50:09He makes Tucker Craft a more effective player. He helps the run game.
50:13He blocks his ass off. He's just this kind of like force multiplier that, you know, he puts the cannon in glass
50:20cannon for this team, to your point. And I think no player on the roster probably better epitomizes that than him.
50:27No, he is absolutely a force multiplier. And it is in the model of the modern NFL.
50:32It does not have to be a lot of plays.
50:35He is not a volume-based player. You can throw it at him, you know, four times.
50:40He can catch three of them for 111 yards and two touchdowns.
50:44And that's it. Like, without him on the field, this offense is a bunch of wide receiver twos being efficient, matriculating the ball down the field.
50:53With Christian Watson on the field, completely transforms their approach, completely transforms what defenses have to account for.
50:58To your point, there's so much more space. There's so much more gravity with him on the field.
51:04So in that particular way, Green Bay had to do this.
51:08I think they found a nice middle ground for, hey, you've been injured a bunch, but we also recognize when you're not injured, you're elite.
51:16So would you stay for this amount? Obviously, he re-upped for that.
51:19And again, hopefully he stays healthy because Green Bay's offense is a whole lot more fun to watch with Christian Watson making plays.
51:27As far as outside additions, again, don't have a whole lot of money to work with, but they did bring in Zaire
51:34Franklin for $9 million a year, which is cheaper than Quay Walker, at least.
51:38To Rod Taylor, $2.5 million. 37 years young, still going.
51:41Love to see it. He might play until he's 40 at this point, which is a great story.
51:47And then Javon Hargrave has history with Jonathan Gannon.
51:50You know, $11.5 million to add to that interior defensive line rotation, which does have some talent, honestly.
51:56Like if you're looking at the entire rotation, assuming they're doing a bunch of odd front stuff, you've got Hargrave, Wyatt, I
52:03guess McClellan, you know, as a rookie might be the starting nose.
52:06We'll see. Ding, ding, ding. We're going to talk about Chris McClellan in the draft section because I think he was my
52:13favorite choice of theirs in the draft this year.
52:16He's the one. And every year we know if you follow bootlegs draft coverage, the Packers always pick a player that I'm
52:23like, oh, this year it was not Brandon Cissé.
52:26It was Chris McClellan. I mean, he's got dynamite in his hands.
52:30So if you're looking for somebody who's going to reset the line of scrimmage, it's going to be him.
52:36You know, you still have that platoon of Georgia guys, right?
52:40You got Brinson. You got Stackhouse. So, like, they do have a fun interior rotation.
52:44I'm not saying it's best in the NFL, but it's enough to complement what Micah gives you that I still think, again,
52:51they could be a very effective pass rush or just a very effective defensive front overall.
52:56Plus, again, you got Edge and Zaire there at the second level.
53:00Like, it's a pretty sick linebacker duo. Now, getting to the draft and Chris McClellan, he wasn't their only pick.
53:07They didn't have a first rounder because of the Micah trade.
53:10And they did have a few needs they had to address early, which they did, most notably, corner in the second round.
53:17Yeah. At pick 52, they get Brandon Cissé, the corner out of South Carolina.
53:22Not necessarily my favorite corner, but you are picking at 52.
53:25So, my favorite corners were mostly off the board.
53:28And I know a lot of Packers fans will say, look, he's not even projected to start.
53:33What did we do with our first pick? And it was their first pick in this year's draft, although he was in the second round.
53:41He's still a very necessary pick for all the reasons we're talking about.
53:46In terms of glass cannon status, you take an injury or two in that secondary, the drop-off is immense.
53:52You need young players, like Brandon Cissé, who are cheap and hopefully effective.
53:56We will see. Again, Green Bay's history with drafting corners is very hit and miss.
54:01When they hit, they really hit. When they miss, they also really miss.
54:05But to all the Packers fans out there thinking, oh, well, he's not a starter and he was our first pick.
54:11He very well could be, just based on percentages of injuries.
54:15Again, cornerback's the most injured position in the NFL.
54:18He's probably going to get an opportunity. He's probably going to get it as a rookie.
54:23See, I actually saw him differently than you throughout the draft process.
54:27I thought he was a better man corner than zone corner.
54:30So again, I look at the fit with Gannon, who ran zone more than I think all but like three teams in the NFL last year.
54:38And I was like, okay, well, he's young. He doesn't have great zone eyes.
54:43Made a lot of mistakes as far as being assignment aware, just letting guys go, not being quick to react.
54:49And then when he played man and he could just rely on his talent, he was fine.
54:55Right? He's fluid. He uses his length well. Not that he has crazy, crazy length, but as far as being able to
55:02play the ball through the receiver's hands, never gives up at the catch point.
55:06Has excellent timing as far as when he can kind of rake the receiver's hands and get it out.
55:12Like he does have a lot of natural gifts as a just sticky man corner.
55:17And then you try to play cover two. It kind of goes out the window.
55:22So I'm curious about the fit because I think it's going to be a zone heavy team.
55:27And I don't, I'm not sure if he's ready to do that yet.
55:31But if it's like third and five and, you know, we're, we're calling man and it's just go out there.
55:38We're playing cat defense. That's your cat. That's my cat.
55:41Go cover your cat. Yeah, he could do that.
55:44Probably better than the guys they have on the roster right now.
55:48But I did find it to be an interesting fit.
55:51That's for sure. Yeah. Then we get to my favorite pick of the Packers made during this draft.
55:56Third round number 77, Chris McClellan, the defensive tackle out of Missouri.
56:00McClellan was a guy that I watched, I will say in between, right?
56:04You never want to watch all the high end guys or all the bottom end guys based on, you know, whatever list
56:11you're looking at when you start out. I like to mix them.
56:15I want to start with some guys kind of in the middle.
56:19I don't want to start with supposedly the very best guy.
56:23McClellan was like fourth or fifth in my watch order.
56:26And I got to him and I was like, okay.
56:29It's very solid against the run. Good size. Like you said, very powerful.
56:33Athletic too. Can move laterally to cover gaps. When he gets, I don't want to say skinny because Chris McClellan is anything but skinny.
56:41When he's able to get thin and push through a gap, he is surprisingly quick in the short area to the quarterback,
56:48which is what defensive tackles need to be. Again, the power comes through, whether it's pass rush or in the run shedding guys.
56:55And I thought, this guy's a really well balanced.
56:58And a lot of defensive tackles in this draft weren't really well balanced.
57:02They were either good at rushing the pass. There were a few of those or they were these mountains that were great run stoppers.
57:10McClellan had better balance than most of the guys I watched.
57:13And I thought, it's just early. He's the fourth or fifth guy.
57:17I've got 15, 20 more guys to get through.
57:20As I kept going, I kept thinking back like, was McClellan that good or was it just early in the process and
57:27I didn't have anything to compare it to? So I would go back and I would watch a little bit more.
57:34I'd watch different situations or whatever else. And I was like, no, I think he's underrated.
57:39And he ended up pretty high in my defensive tackle rankings because of that balance, because of the versatility, very experienced again
57:46in the SEC, played against very quality offensive lines and didn't have too many days where he just disappeared.
57:52Like he made an impact consistently. In both phases.
57:55And I think the Packers stole one and it's why I was angry about it.
57:59He was in that group of DTs I watched late, right?
58:03Like him, DeMonte, Capehart, really all the Clemson guys.
58:06And, you know, again, it was the pop in his hands that really showed up for me because that's something you can't really teach.
58:13Like either you can jolt an offensive lineman, you know, defensive line coach is called putting a dent.
58:19In the blocking scheme. Either you can put that dent in there or you can't.
58:24And it's not even just an upper body thing.
58:27It's not a lower body thing. It's not a core thing.
58:30It's a whole body strength, right? The ability to sink your feet with your hips, with your hands and like really maximize yourself biomechanically.
58:38And it's both strength and timing and hand placement all kind of rolled into one that determines whether or not that center just goes backwards against his will.
58:47He's got that. He absolutely has got that. And, you know, how many defensive tackles have we seen go in the third,
58:54fourth round that, you know, if that's the only thing they can do, you know, they build a 10-year career off of it.
59:01Like Daquan Jones, right? Like he can play in the NFL forever just because he can do that.
59:07But I think he might be able to do more than that, too.
59:11So if he can be like a nose tackle that also gives you pass rush potential at 77th overall, sign me up for that.
59:19Yeah. Like I love this pick. Yeah, I think it's in there for sure.
59:23In the fourth round at 120, deny Dennis Sutton.
59:26And I'm not sure whether it's Dennis Sutton or Denny Sutton, but either way, the edge out of Penn State.
59:32Very good size. Very athletic. Was super excited when I got to his tape.
59:37And then I got to his tape. And I didn't see all those athletic gifts translate to play on the field in
59:44pads week to week, down to down. So I watched another game.
59:48It was pretty whelmed. Not underwhelmed. He has flashes.
59:51He has some power. But they are few and far between.
59:54And he didn't make the impact that his athletic gifts, which are substantial, would imply that he could make.
60:00So it's a translation issue. We've seen this from athletes in every single position in the NFL.
60:06So it's the reason he was available in the fourth.
60:09His production scores don't match his athletic scores. His tape does not translate to all those amazing athletic gifts, size, length, explosion,
60:16to your point, bend, and change of direction, which really was not a highlight on his tape.
60:21So it's why he was available. We'll see if he is, you know, on tape, he's very linear.
60:27He's a lot like Lucas Van Ness was in terms of powerful, long, linear, not super bendy.
60:32Lucas Van Ness was a better version of that, which is why he was drafted higher.
60:37You know, Danai was one of those guys that you were hoping to see more from, or at least I was, and
60:44I didn't, which is why they got him in the fourth round.
60:48Moves a lot like Osi Yumanura, right? Because Osi also would kind of have this, like, upright style as a rusher, and
60:55then he would turn the corner somehow really quickly.
60:58The issue is Osi had some of the best hands I've ever seen.
61:02Like, he just kept tackles off him. And it's maybe unfair to compare a college player to Osi Yumanura, but, like, it is what it is.
61:10I don't think he's developed that skill set to keep a tackle off him.
61:15And when you're not super bendy, and, like, you have power, but not, you know, Jared Ver's power, you're going to have
61:22to be able to keep a tackle off you.
61:25And I don't think he has the hands for that quite yet.
61:29Could get there. Like, don't get me wrong, could get there.
61:32But it might be a little bit of a long road.
61:36We'll see. Yeah. In the fifth round at 153, they get the center out of Kentucky, Yeager Burton.
61:41And I think this is an interesting pick. I like it, but I'm afraid of it, again, as a Bears fan, because,
61:48man, fourth, fifth, six-round picks along the interior offensive line tend to hang around for the Packers for six or seven years and play pretty well.
61:57Yeager Burton, good size, 6'4", 3'12", 32-inch arms, which is why he's projected at center and not either guard.
62:03He could play guard, but certainly not tackle. Well, they have him listed as Belton's backup at right guard, which intrigued me
62:10because I thought he would back up Ryan at center.
62:13But maybe he's backing up both. Yeah, he does have the flexibility, which was one of the things I liked about his game coming out of Kentucky.
62:22Technically proficient based on quickness. And when I say quickness, I mean both quickness with his hands to get into the defensive
62:29line and also quickness with his feet to keep his frame in front of defensive linemen.
62:34So that quickness combines with good movement skills when he was asked to pull, which was a lot at Kentucky, a lot of outside zone there.
62:42He's good at that, too. He's not great at anchoring.
62:45It's something that a lot of centers struggle with, especially when they get to the NFL and the power ranks up on the inside of the defensive line.
62:54So he can get pushed around in solo pass pro.
62:57If he's not in a duo block and he is against a monstrous defensive tackle, he can give ground and enough ground that it affects the quarterback's throw.
63:06But he is really good again at realizing what he's not good at and using that quickness to wall them off.
63:13Right. If you're going one way or another, I'm going to pivot my hips really quickly and run you around my quarterback
63:20because I know I just can't stop here. You know, sink my hips and, you know, dig in in a step or
63:27a hop and a hop and a half. So you're going to push and I'm going to realize where I have leverage
63:34and I'm going to use my hands and feet to turn you and run you by because I know I'm not that
63:41basically block of granite in the passing game. So understands run game in terms of leverage and angles, uses his quickness pretty
63:48well, missed some targets the second level, which I was a little disappointed about because it's one of the things I thought
63:55he was going to be best at. But lots to work with here.
63:59And again, if you get a guy in the fifth round that is versatile between guard and center, has experience and can
64:06fill in, can build strength in the NFL as many young players along the offensive line do.
64:11I think it's a pretty worthy pick. He's 6'4", 320, with experience at all three interior spots, 4-4-5 short shuttle, you know, incredible RAS.
64:19He's like a 99th percentile athlete overall. What's not to love, right, as far as balls of clay in the day three
64:26of the draft for a team that develops a lot of balls of clay out of day three picks in the draft?
64:33It feels like they got another one, you know, another late pick, super high upside Packers offensive lineman that's just probably going to work out.
64:41Yeah, go figure. Sixth round at 2-0. And they get Damani Jackson, the cornerback out of Alabama, who is a player much like for you with McClellan.
64:50I got too late, was very impressed with his size and athletic profile and thought, why haven't I seen more from this guy?
64:57I got to his tape and I was like, oh, maybe that's why.
65:01But I also think it's maybe situational. Sometimes it's coaching.
65:04Sometimes it's scheme. I think there's more on tap here.
65:07Again, we're not going to get to see it early at corner.
65:11He's going to have to use those physical gifts, size and speed specifically at special teams to make the team.
65:18But he could work his way into the rotation.
65:21He is physically gifted. He did not make the SEC play in corner as a slow or small guy.
65:27But again, when he was in the game, it just didn't see that much impact.
65:31He was just one of those guys that I will term as there.
65:35But there were a few flashes, few and far between.
65:39You had to dig through a lot of tape to get to them.
65:43But I asked around a little bit about him and basically everybody came back with the same sort of thing is, hey, he just hasn't earned the opportunities.
65:52It's not that he doesn't have the ability or the flashes, but for some reason for multiple years, hasn't ascended to that top ranking college.
66:00So is he going to do it at the pros?
66:03Not a question I can answer. But in terms of potential height, weight, speed, picking in the sixth round, go for it.
66:10I'm there with you, honestly, on him. I think both these picks were special teams picks in the sixth round.
66:16I mean, Trey Smack is a kicker. So you can't be a special teams pick.
66:21I will not let you talk about kickers a lot on this podcast a little bit, but come on.
66:27Your kicker's name is Trey Smack. Get out. That's the greatest kicker name ever.
66:32It's like Cam Little being, you know, 170 pounds soaking wet and having a massive leg.
66:37It's awesome. I love it. And again, he can't be worse than McManus was last year.
66:42Like, it's almost impossible. So I'm just going to call that upgrade by default.
66:46They got a better kicker this year. And, you know, maybe Damonte Jackson can make it on special teams, too.
66:53I'm not sure he would make it as a corner that they have to rely on to play.
66:58I'll put it that way. As far as UDFAs, you know, I think you and I both agree on Jaden Nixon.
67:05Like, he's another one of these, you know, really fast slashing, you know, get him into a wide zone type system running
67:12backs that always comes out of college where, you know, he might not be the best at running through contact or really just breaking tackles at all.
67:21But if you give him a crease, he can turn that crease into 30 yards.
67:25So there's potential that he could make the roster as RB4, I would say.
67:30But that's predominantly because I think he also has special teams utility, keeping it with the theme.
67:35He's a really good kick returner, right? When he was in Oklahoma State, you can go look up the clip.
67:42He, you know, took one back to the house against Baylor and he was gone.
67:46Like, as soon as he cleared that first level.
67:49So got serious speed. Again, not somebody who's going to break a lot of tackles.
67:54But, you know, give him five to seven touches in a game.
67:58See if he can just get you an explosive.
68:01You know, he's got the speed to do that.
68:04Yeah, he shot out of a cannon. 5'10", 185.
68:06Not going to blow you away getting off the bus, but 7.8 yards per carry.
68:11Didn't have that many carries. That's why it didn't add up to that much.
68:16And again, to your point, only six missed tackles forced on 71 carries.
68:20But if you miss him just purely on speed and he makes people miss on speed, which sometimes doesn't get recorded as
68:27a missed tackle force because he literally just runs by you and breaks the angle.
68:32If you're not in the way of him, he is gone.
68:35And that element, just that slice of his game reminds me of Jameer Gibbs.
68:40It is that kind of burst. He is not the runner overall that Jameer Gibbs is.
68:45Does not have the technical proficiency. But that like, oh yeah, that fear you see from a defensive back going, I'm not
68:52sure I can flatten enough to get to this guy because he's going to get by me.
68:57To your point, extremely valuable on special teams as well.
69:0023.6 yard average on kick returns. That was fifth for kick return yardage overall in this year's draft eligible players.
69:07Just lightning in a bottle. He is smaller. He's not going to be down your every down back.
69:12But if you've got a couple of plays where you think you can get him in space, also really good in the short passing game.
69:20Good hands. He didn't get a lot of targets.
69:23This is more, again, wasn't asked to. It's not that he can't.
69:27He caught 13 of his 15 targets. So lots of yards after the catch.
69:32He was one of those guys that didn't get targets down the field as a running back, as a lot of them don't.
69:39But he turned a lot of those shorter targets into longer gains purely with I got gas and oh yeah, you thought
69:46you were going to cover me with a linebacker.
69:49Yeah, that was a terrible choice. I also want to bring up Kyron drones, quarterback at a VT.
69:54He's been somebody who, you know, college football fans are like, man, when he puts it all together for, I don't know,
70:01four years now at this point, I don't know if he's ever going to put it all together, but he's got a lot of talent.
70:09So he's coming into the year as QB for almost certainly going to be a practice squad guy.
70:15But once upon a time, they brought in Malik Willis, who I want to be clear here, Malik Willis way better in college, but way better prospect.
70:24But once upon a time, Malik Willis looked lost in the wilderness, didn't know what he was doing, didn't look like he had a future in the league.
70:33Green Bay brought him in, turned him into Malik Willis.
70:36And now he's, you know, making $22 million a year as a starter for Miami.
70:41So I think Kyron drones, again, saw that and was like, I would like for you to do that for me.
70:47Teach me your ways, Matt LaFleur. And I think he'll be a practice squad guy and probably a scout team guy for them.
70:55This was, this is a legacy holdover for Green Bay from the Ron Wolf days when Ron Wolf said draft a quarterback every year, bring him in.
71:03And many of their backups, they traded away for high picks, which helped them build the dynasty years of the Packers.
71:10And, you know, if they can start that conveyor belt going again, it will be incredibly valuable to Goody in this front office.
71:17The other player to mention is RJ Maryland, the tight end from SMU.
71:21SMU had two tight ends this year. Both of them were good.
71:25RJ Maryland, more of a passing threat, is dynamic.
71:28Again, isn't going to be pushing for the starting role.
71:31But until Tucker Craft is back at full speed, he's at least going to get some looks in camp.
71:37And that's going to be very valuable for him as a UDFA.
71:41UDFA. We'll see if he makes the roster once they're settling out, you know, value overall, but did show value on tape
71:48was a guy that flashed for me. And I, you know, there were a lot of tight ends in this year's class,
71:55a lot of different types, but RJ Maryland sort of down in that, what I figured was like fifth or sixth round range.
72:02I was like, you're getting a value at that point as a UDFA.
72:07That's a home run. Speaking of having two great players at one position on one team, by the way, should be noted
72:14for the folks at home, Jaden Nixon, the running back we were talking about earlier, four or five years ago in high
72:21school, his backfield mate in Frisco, Texas. I can just imagine all these 16 year olds in the area having to tackle
72:28a backfield in high school of Jaden Nixon and Ashton Gentry.
72:31Get fucked. Good luck. If either one of us plays tonight, we're going to win.
72:36But bad news for you guys, we're both playing.
72:39So no, no downs off for you. Yeah. Oh, I can.
72:42We've, we've talked about community college rosters with two now NFL defensive linemen on the D line rotation.
72:48Like there are just those times when you wander into a game as a, you know, at that point, 17 or 18 year old and go, wait, what?
72:57Oh, all right. Like, I guess I know how this one's going to go.
73:01Like when you play modern day, it's like, well, he's going to USC and he's going to Georgia and he's going to
73:08Michigan and he's going to Notre Dame. Guess I'll just die.
73:12Yeah. Hopefully slowly, but probably not probably quickly. Before we get to ceiling of floor, we do have our patron viewer note.
73:19It's on a topic we haven't really addressed much yet.
73:22It's a tight end room. It comes from Nick Baker.
73:25Nick says, what's the situation with Luke Musgrave? He was a second round tight end, but he's been lackluster with the league's moves to 12 and 13 personnel.
73:34What are the Packers going to do with him?
73:37Do they even have any blocking tight ends? I mean, when Tucker craft is healthy, I think I was going to say
73:44Tucker craft was known as a blocking tight end in college.
73:48He became more of a receiving threat when he got to the league because he's big and really fast.
73:54But yes, they do. If Tucker craft is healthy, Musgrave to me reminds me a little bit of a lesser version of
74:01Colston Loveland and the fact that he was not regarded as a blocking tight end.
74:05He has great movement skills. He has very good size.
74:09He was okay as a blocker. To be fair, Loveland is a better blocker than Musgrave was.
74:14But Musgrave was not a nothing as a blocker.
74:17He's again, better in some types of blocks, not digging out defensive ends.
74:21But on the move, he was a good blocker.
74:24I actually went to his pro day at Oregon State and he was the reason.
74:29He was the draw that year. Again, as the commenter mentioned, second round tight end.
74:33And he's got potential to show up for them in the passing game and is a fun option.
74:39He has not yet done it. And again, he too has suffered injury.
74:43But boy, what a luxury to have a guy like Tucker craft develop as quickly as he did and really ascend to look.
74:51Tucker craft looks like when he's healthy, he's one of the best tight ends in the national football league.
74:57And oh yeah, we spent a second round pick on a guy.
75:01We wanted to be that in Luke Musgrave. And even if he's our TE2 and versatile and we can only use him
75:08on move blocks or we can really roll him into the passing game because that was his bread and butter coming out of Oregon State.
75:15That to me feels like a luxury. And oh yeah, their TE3 Josh Wiley is another guy we like to is, I
75:22think, properly slotted as a tight end three. But that's not a bad room if, and here's the letters, huge if they're
75:30healthy because two of them right now are dinged up.
75:33And even, you know, if we're trying to decide between TE2 and TE3, it's kind of murky between Wiley and Musgrave.
75:39Who's the two and who's the three? But Musgrave obviously has more potential, right?
75:44Like when he was in college, you look at a frame, it's like a 6'5 tight end, runs like a deer.
75:51It almost didn't make sense to me how much he didn't translate to the league.
75:55Because guys like him are succeeding everywhere, right? Like fucking Charlie Kohler worked out.
76:00I was like, how did you not work out?
76:03And Charlie Kohler worked out. I don't know. I really don't know.
76:06And maybe it's injury. Maybe it's an environment that doesn't suit him.
76:10I have no idea why he hasn't worked so far.
76:13Luckily for them, when they double dipped, Tucker Craft did.
76:17Which, if anything, is more ammo for the folks that believe that quantity of picks is the most important thing you can have than having high picks.
76:25Because it's really a numbers game in the draft.
76:28And if you're not 100% certain about a player, which really after you get past the first 10 to 12 picks, you're
76:35probably not going to be certain about a player.
76:38Just get as many bites at the apple as you can get.
76:42Because even if you miss on Musgrave, you might hit on Craft.
76:46This team was 7th overall in 12 personnel uses last year.
76:49So, regardless of who's the 2, who's the 3, they're all going to be on the field a significant amount.
76:56I just hope that they get more out of Musgrave this year.
76:59I hope he turns into what I thought he could have been.
77:03My dynasty team is begging for it. I've just been sitting there for like 4 years.
77:08Never started him once. Maybe that's a me issue.
77:11Maybe I should have let him go a long time ago.
77:15Well, maybe not. Maybe you were just... Now or never.
77:18Maybe you were wrong. You were just very, very, very early.
77:21But again, to the commenter's point, 12 and 13 personnel.
77:24We're talking about 13 personnel. They're all in the field at once.
77:28And again, more teams are going to be leaning into that.
77:32Are the Packers one of them? They haven't been necessarily traditionally, but doesn't mean they won't be.
77:37And again, LeFleur, same rough tree as McVay. And McVay is leading that charge.
77:42They have the personnel to do it. Is it their best lineup?
77:46It's probably not. But again, like you said, if two or three is healthy and functioning between Musgrave and Wiley, you're pretty well set up for 12 personnel.
77:54And that is going to be something that they've done and possibly do more of moving into 2026.
78:00Now, what do we say when we get to ceiling and floor?
78:04Close this thing out each. I want to preface this by saying the Packers early season schedule is brutal.
78:10Mike is coming off injury. Tucker's coming off injury.
78:13They lost some depth because of, you know, they're up against it in the cap.
78:18They're counting on some young players to develop and maybe they will and maybe they won't.
78:23But their schedule starts as such. On the road at Minnesota.
78:26On the road at the Jets. Obviously a winnable game.
78:29Hosting the Falcons. And Atlanta voodoo early in the year.
78:33You never know what you're going to get. Then they go on the road at Tampa.
78:38Hosting Chicago. Hosting Dallas. On the road at Detroit.
78:41Got a feisty Panthers team Halloween weekend. And then you're on the road at New England.
78:46Then you're hosting Minnesota. Then you got the Rams.
78:49Fucking Saints after that. They're not even a bad team.
78:52Oh, Buffalo. Great. We're in December now, by the way.
78:55Okay, cool. We get a break with the Dolphins in December.
78:58And we got to go on the road to the Bears.
79:02Hosting the Texans. Great. Awesome. Love this. And then you finish with Detroit.
79:06There's like three games there that you feel good about.
79:09The entire schedule. And the first half of that.
79:12You know, you're going to have Micah coming off injury.
79:15I don't think he's going to be starting week one.
79:19Tucker coming off injury. It's tough. That's why my ceiling's 11.
79:22It's not that they're a bad team. They're probably going to make the playoffs.
79:26But it's going to be, again, probably another wildcard thing.
79:30Because this team has a brutal, brutal schedule. They're not going to be 100%.
79:34Like, the floor's still nine. I don't think they're going to lose.
79:38I don't think they're going to win less than nine games.
79:41But my window is a two-game swing here. Or it's nine to 11.
79:46Just because of all the factors that I mentioned.
79:48Like, you've got to play all the heavy hitters of the NFL.
79:52At least almost all of them. And you're down two of your three best players to start the year.
79:58I don't know, man. It's a tough hole to climb out of.
80:02It is. They're going to have to thread a bunch of needles.
80:06Hit a bunch of green lights. Whatever you want to talk about.
80:10I'll talk about my ceiling and floor and ceiling and why it could all work.
80:15And floor, how it could all fall apart. My ceiling is 12.
80:18One game higher than yours. Because again, when this team, starting off with LePleur and Love as an elite pairing of play
80:25caller and quarterback, they make great things accessible on offense always.
80:29When they are there and vibing, they can get it done.
80:32To your point from early, early on in this episode of like, we can do it.
80:38We're super confident. We can get points when we want to.
80:41Typically, when those two are seeing the game the same way, they can.
80:45They've got healthy impact stars on offense and defense.
80:48We've talked about that. Wasson, Josh Jacobs, Micah. Again, when he's healthy.
80:52When everyone's healthy and it's all working. One of the most capable teams in the NFL.
80:57And I could see them going on a run, even against a tough schedule.
81:01Winning 12 games. LeFleur, I think, has a chip on his shoulder from last year.
81:06A lot of people, including a lot of Green Bay fans.
81:10We're watching this. We're doubting him. And saying, ah, I'm not sure he's the right guy.
81:15I was like, go ahead, fire him. That would make me feel much better as a Bears fan.
81:21Again, always a threat. Never an easy game against Green Bay when LeFleur's the head coach.
81:26My floor is the same as yours. Nine wins.
81:28How could all fall apart? Health and depth is where it starts.
81:32Wide receiver core. Very thin. Good, but very thin.
81:35Defensive line depth is worrisome. Given Micah's injury history, even more worrisome.
81:39Add those factors into Halfley's departure and getting to know his new personnel.
81:43We think his new personnel is better. But there's always a, hey, guys, you've got to see this the same way that I'm calling it.
81:51And that could, I'm going to say could, not will, to keep all the Green Bay fans off my back a little
81:58bit, lead to a slow start for this team.
82:01You add in the schedule. You add in the fact that division is going to be really tough again.
82:07Again, last year, all three of the second, third, and fourth place teams all had nine wins.
82:12Like, it's going to be dog-eat-dog for the entire time.
82:16It could set up some struggles for this team and a hole that they could have to dig out of.
82:22And again, I'm with you. I think they have the talent to do that.
82:26I think, again, the schedule lets up a tiny little bit.
82:30Hopefully, the health will catch up mid-season to them.
82:33It's just going to be a slog, but I don't see them winning with all that talent and the head coaches that
82:40we talked about winning less than nine games. Twelve is the absolute maximum, but it would have to be everything just so.
82:47And if that was the case, they would be extremely dangerous going into the playoffs.
82:52So it's only a three-game swing, and yes, it's very similar to all the other teams we've talked about in the NFC North.
82:59But hey, man, not going to apologize. That's this division right now.
83:03It is state-of-the-art. It is super tough, and you're not going to get a week off.
83:08They'll be battle-tested. That's for sure. If they make January, they will be battle-tested.
83:12So we'll see how it shakes out. Once again, I want to thank all of you for watching and listening, wherever you happen to be watching and listening.
83:21The Bears episode is live 24 hours early over on our partners over at Buzzer.
83:26They've helped us produce this entire series. And if you want to watch each subsequent episode 24 hours early, they're always going
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83:36That's linked down in the description below or at the QR code on screen.
83:40And then reminder for all of our patrons, this Friday, we're picking our NFC North winner and Rookies of the Year and
83:47Coach of the Year and MVPs of the division in our NFC North recap episode.
83:52That's going to be live for all patrons on Friday.
83:55And if you're watching this in the future, it's live now.
83:59So you can go check that out. Either way, thank you all for watching.
84:03Thank you to our patrons, our executive producers on Patreon, our sponsors, Buzzer, Woodinville, Homage, everybody.
84:08We will see you tomorrow for what I assume is going to be our most watched video of the summer, the Bears episode.
84:16shit.
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