Late-Round Perspectives: Austin Ekeler
STACKED extracted the fantasy-relevant player signal from this podcast and kept the full transcript here for context.
35 min
Duration
Estimated from transcript
Sep 11, 2026
Published
Fri, September 11, 2026
23
Player insights
21
Players mentioned
Topics
Austin EkelerAlvin KamaraChristian McCaffreyDalvin CookDavid MontgomeryDerrick HenryGeorge KittleJahmyr GibbsJavonte WilliamsJaylen WarrenJosh JohnsonKeenan AllenKenneth Walker IIIKimani Vidal
Player analysis
Player insights
Alvin Kamara
PositiveUsage45:34
Austin Ekeler highlights Alvin Kamara as a primary example of a running back who benefited from a coordinator's philosophy (Joe Lombardi) that prioritized check-downs and short passes to the flat.
Insight pageAustin Ekeler
PositiveInjury0:56
Austin Ekeler confirms he has fully recovered from last year's injury, stating his mind and body are ready to move forward.
Insight pageNegativeUsage8:34
Austin Ekeler prefers playing out of the shotgun formation because it provides a clearer view of the field, allows him to avoid being blocked by the quarterback, and aligns with his strengths as a pass-catching running back.
Insight pageNegativeRole40:14
Austin Ekeler describes his current career stage as a specialist for third downs, two-minute drills, and passing situations, emphasizing that he provides value by complementing a team's primary early-down runner.
Insight pageChristian McCaffrey
PositiveUsage38:50
Austin Ekeler identifies Christian McCaffrey as a premier, all-around back who demands respect because he can handle all three phases: running between the tackles, pass protection, and catching passes out of the backfield.
Insight pageDalvin Cook
PositiveUsage38:56
Austin Ekeler lists Dalvin Cook among the elite running backs who have proven they can handle all three phases of the game, including pass protection and receiving out of the backfield.
Insight pageDavid Montgomery
PositiveBreakout50:52
Austin Ekeler predicts a big year for David Montgomery, suggesting he has top-10 potential due to his new contract and the Lions' offensive environment, even while sharing the backfield with Jahmyr Gibbs.
Insight pageDerrick Henry
NegativeRole39:18
Austin Ekeler notes that while Derrick Henry is a dominant runner, his skill set may not make him the ideal choice for third-down passing situations, leading teams to utilize complementary backs in those roles.
Insight pageGeorge Kittle
PositiveInjury1:46
JJ Zachariason highlights George Kittle's rapid return from an Achilles injury, noting he is ready to play this week.
Insight pageJahmyr Gibbs
NegativeDepth Chart51:57
Austin Ekeler notes that David Montgomery's fantasy outlook is distinct from Jahmyr Gibbs', as Montgomery is expected to carve out a significant role despite the split-carry nature of the Lions' backfield.
Insight pageJavonte Williams
NegativeUsage49:18
JJ Zachariason expresses concern regarding Javonte Williams' fantasy profile, noting that his lack of efficiency through the air makes his role fragile and susceptible to being overtaken by a more efficient pass-catching teammate.
Insight pageJaylen Warren
PositiveUsage50:16
JJ Zachariason praises Jalen Warren for his consistent efficiency on a per-route-run basis, highlighting him as a standout pass-catching back despite competition for snaps.
Insight pageJosh Johnson
PositiveRole5:08
JJ Zachariason praises Josh Johnson for his extensive experience and the wisdom he provides based on his time with numerous NFL teams.
Insight pageKeenan Allen
NegativeUsage52:26
Austin Ekeler notes that Keenan Allen's departure leaves a significant target void in the Chargers' offense, which Ladd McConkey is well-positioned to fill given their overlapping roles.
Insight pageKenneth Walker III
NegativeUsage44:19
JJ Zachariason notes that Kenneth Walker is a capable pass catcher who has been limited by team scheme and coordinator philosophy, resulting in target shares that fluctuate between 8% and 13% depending on the offensive system.
Insight pageKimani Vidal
PositiveBreakout54:04
Austin Ekeler makes a bold prediction that Kimani Hampton (referred to as O'Marrion Hampton) will lead the league in rushing touchdowns, citing the Chargers' commitment to running the ball under their new coaching staff.
Insight pageLadd McConkey
PositiveBreakout52:23
Austin Ekeler expects a breakout year for Ladd McConkey, noting that he and Keenan Allen share similar skill sets and that McConkey is poised to capitalize on his third-year development in the Chargers' offense.
Insight pageMalik Nabers
NegativeInjury1:46
JJ Zachariason notes that Malik Nabers is currently dealing with an injury and working through a recovery timeline.
Insight pageMelvin Gordon
NegativeDepth Chart13:42
Austin Ekeler recalls his rookie season where he served as the backup to starter Melvin Gordon, who dealt with a lingering injury that provided Ekeler with his first offensive opportunities.
Insight pageRhamondre Stevenson
PositiveRole34:03
JJ Zachariason notes that Rhamondre Stevenson is a reliable player who does everything right, including pass protection and grinding out tough yards, which earns him trust from coaches despite the presence of more explosive teammates.
Insight pageSaquon Barkley
PositiveUsage38:53
Austin Ekeler highlights Saquon Barkley as one of the few elite running backs in the league capable of contributing in all three phases of the game, including pass protection and receiving.
Insight pageTy Montgomery
NegativeRole34:19
JJ Zachariason references Ty Montgomery as an explosive back who showed flashes of high-end production, such as his game against Tampa Bay, but notes he struggled to maintain the same level of coaching trust as Rhamondre Stevenson.
Insight pageZach Charbonnet
NegativeInjury3:28
JJ Zachariason mentions that Zach Charbonnet was placed on the PUP list but is being discussed as having an expedited recovery timeline.
Insight pageFull transcript
Episode Transcript
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0:35Austin Eckler is an NFL running back who's the all-time leading rusher for Western Colorado University.
0:40He has the second most yards from scrimmage of any undrafted running back in NFL history.
0:44He's a husband, a PPR machine, and he wants to be the commissioner of fantasy football.
0:48These are his late round perspectives. Kind of crazy getting ready for football and fantasy season all coming together.
0:53You know how it goes. How are you feeling after last year's injury?
0:56I'm feeling good now. I've had enough time to recover, and my mind and the body have fully established themselves as ready
1:02to go forward now from the injury. I feel like that's got to be a big...
1:06I know they're talking about that. Malik Nabors coming back and Kittle obviously had the Achilles as well.
1:11I would imagine that... I know they say this a lot for running backs in particular, that the larger hurdle isn't even the physical.
1:17It's just the mental of being able to go back out there and take hits and do all that.
1:22Is that true? It's part of it. You know, there's a lot of pieces to it.
1:26I think the biggest thing that you don't really realize when you're in it or when you're not in it is that there's two get backs.
1:33You have to heal and then you have to get back in shape.
1:36Yeah. There's two parts of it. You know, if you weren't an athlete, you could just heal and then be fine.
1:41But then since you're an athlete, you have to also get back in shape and not just shape, but you have to
1:47get back in the top shape of your life to be able to compete at the highest level.
1:52So it's really, really particular on being able to get back as much as you can.
1:56And now that modern medicine's got as good as it is, it's expected that you can come back from it.
2:01But it's a lot easier said than done. Doesn't it feel like that some of these guys are coming back faster this year than like ever be?
2:08I mean, like even like I'm looking at like Zach Charbonnet, who, yes, was put on PUP.
2:12But at the same time, like they're talking about this, like, you know, expedited timeline for him or even like Kittle himself,
2:18you know, like he's playing this week, you know, and he's ready to go.
2:22Like, do you think that is a modern medicine type deal going on there?
2:25I don't want to say that it's like, you know, like peptides or anything like that.
2:30But but obviously there's like a lot of stuff just going on there where we're seeing these these guys get back and healthier quicker.
2:36It seems like. Yeah. Yeah. I think you see that just in modern medicine in general, you know, we're having we're coming
2:41up with more and more things to help us recover faster, recover from things that maybe weren't thought to be recoverable from like now Achilles.
2:48If you come back from Achilles ACL, all these year injuries, like your ending injuries, you're expected to come back next year.
2:54So I would say that alone is a sign that our medicine has gotten so good that, yeah, nothing really can stop
2:59you from a ligament or tendon standpoint at this point.
3:02Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy, man. Well, I do want to say so I was I was at Radio Row last year and we interviewed Josh Johnson.
3:09Yeah. Part of that commander's team last year. And one of the things first off, he was great because he has all
3:14the experience that he has being on all the teams that he has.
3:18And I just love the wisdom he was able to drop just based on that experience and whatnot.
3:22But one of the things that I did want to ask you real quick before we kind of dug into you with
3:28fantasy and I want to I want to really ask a lot of nerdy running back questions, too.
3:33Sure. So David Blau stepping up being the OC there.
3:35He had a lot. You know, Josh had a lot of good things to say about Blau.
3:40I'm curious about what your thoughts are. And then on top of that, one of the big things with Cliff Kingsbury's offense is a lot of shotgun, right?
3:47I mean, like they led the league in shock in the last two years by like a very, very high rate.
3:52And so first off, I want to hear your thoughts on Blau if you have any.
3:56But then the other the other thing I want to hear about is you as a running back.
4:01Do you prefer playing out of shotgun playing under center?
4:04Like what like like is there a is it more comfortable for you one way or another?
4:08Obviously, I think you come from a really interesting perspective, too, because your past catching background.
4:12But I just want to kind of hear hear what your thoughts are about that that commanders team with David Blau.
4:18Yeah, I think we'll start with the David Blau comment.
4:20I think something as a player that we don't always see is the coaching side behind the scenes, because if we're getting
4:26installs presented to us, it's usually by our position coach or the coordinator.
4:29And so we don't get to see all of the inside of the meeting, like who's coming up with plays, like how
4:35they're all being coordinated and things like that. But David Blau, he would every once in a while go up and share
4:41a play with us, you know, that he that he created.
4:44And so there's a little hint of like, oh, OK, maybe he's doing a little bit more behind the scenes like we're
4:49not in their staff meetings and stuff like that.
4:52So for you to become a assistant and then go to a coordinator role, there's got to be a ton of trust
4:57in that head coach and that GM as well, because their their job is on the line.
5:02So you don't just get promoted like that. There's not a ton of trust.
5:05So he had obviously shown some sort of growth and some sort of commitment to that being able to take on that
5:11role in the last two years as he was under Cliff Kingsbury.
5:14And yeah, with Cliff kind of transitioning to the shotgun question for me, I prefer being a shotgun and I've never been
5:20like a big between the tackles runner. I'm just not a big person.
5:23It's harder for me to run through arm tackles.
5:25You know, yeah, I can do it. But the mass of a, you know, a defensive lineman takes a little bit more
5:31toll on 195 pounds as opposed to maybe 220, you know, some of these guys out here.
5:36So I like being from shotgun. Also, I think it allows me to see better because the quarterback's not in my way.
5:41Typically for under center quarterbacks coming straight back. So I got to move to the left or to the right immediately.
5:47And so if we're a shotgun, I can see the full picture of quarterbacks already behind me as he takes his drop
5:52and I can get a little bit clearer picture from the line.
5:55So, and also I like to catch the ball too.
5:58So if we're in shotgun, you know, we're probably, we're probably in a throwing formation.
6:02So I'll take that. Yeah. Yeah. I was going to say, I would imagine from your perspective too, out of shotgun, it's
6:08just easier to kind of like get into space, kind of get a, get a feel for what's around you out in the flat.
6:14And then you're able to do your thing as a pass catcher, right?
6:17Let me give you this. Yeah. Let me give you this scenario.
6:20So I had a scenario actually two years ago, Jaden, and we were running a play action from under center and I had protection.
6:26I had pass protection on the same play. I stepped to the left to go do the play action.
6:31My defender came from the right side. Right. Right.
6:34So I'm going, Jaden's coming straight back. He's not looking down the field.
6:37He's looking back at me to, to give me a ball fake.
6:40And I got to go, I got to go right, but I'm stepping left.
6:44So I got to get over there. And I ended up getting blasted because I was in a good position because I
6:49was just too late to get over there. And I get thrown right into Jaden.
6:53It's a sack. And so like instances like that, that I would prefer if we were just doing a play action from
6:59the shotgun where he's already going to be behind me and I can abort and I don't have to go around him.
7:05So there's some technical things like that, that I would prefer, you know, being from, being from the shotgun.
7:10Yeah. Makes a lot of sense. All right. I want to talk to you about fantasy too.
7:14So you sort of become like an ambassador within the, within the space.
7:17You know, I see you everywhere, you know, you're, you're, you're, you're speaking our language, us, us nerds and mom's basement.
7:23And we appreciate that greatly, but I'm curious, you know, you embracing fantasy football.
7:26When did you first realize that fantasy was just having such a tangible impact on the way that fans kind of viewed
7:32you as a player and how that's evolved and what you think locker rooms feel about the game these days?
7:37Yeah. Let's jump into it. I think, first of all, I would love to professionalize fantasy sports in some type of way
7:43and be the commissioner of professional fantasy sports. I'm here for that.
7:46And so that's the project I'm working on for next year, but that's, you said, I'm trying to, I'm kind of becoming like an ambassador.
7:53I would love to be the commissioner of the professional league.
7:55Love it. So that's in the works. But fantasy, when did I first come into fantasy and realized the community was as dedicated as they were?
8:02It was my rookie year. So my rookie year, I was a third string running back and really was just playing on special teams.
8:08And then about three weeks in our backup ends up hurting his hamstring and I get elevated to second string.
8:14And this is like the first time I've ever gotten like some, some real burn as a, as a backup.
8:19Uh, Melvin Gordon was in front of us as a starter.
8:22He actually had like some lingering injury. So I was like, Austin, you're going to get some, you're gonna get some play at offense this, this week.
8:29And this is a big jump for me. Cause I'm, like I said, usually playing on special teams.
8:33And so we're playing Jacksonville and I ended up popping off.
8:36I had like two touchdowns and like 70 yards as a, as a waiver pickup that you're like desperate.
8:41I need someone on the bench. Maybe like I got to bring someone in.
8:45So rarely anyone picked me up that week, but I ended up scoring.
8:48I don't even know, like 15 points in fantasy.
8:50And in that game, I was in that four minute offense at the end of the game, ended up fumbling the ball.
8:56I fumbled the ball and we lose the game in overtime because of that.
9:00Basically that kind of led them to score a point and tie in the game.
9:03And at the end of the game, I had a ton of fans that were pissed.
9:08Charger fans, a rookie should never be in the game.
9:10That moment was too big for you. Yada, yada, yada.
9:13Just ripping me. All of a sudden, I also have this huge community of fantasy fans.
9:17We love you. You're awesome. Like you're the best.
9:19Like, I didn't know you could do that. Like, so I have all this love.
9:23I'm like, who the heck are these people? So that was my first introduction to fantasy was, uh, ended up losing the
9:29game, but they didn't care what the, what the scoreboard said.
9:32They just cared that I played well. Um, and so ever since then I started to kind of embrace this community that
9:37didn't, didn't really care about the logo. They don't care about the name on your, on your, on the front, right?
9:43They just care about the name on the back and that you do well.
9:46Is Austin doing well for my team? And so I really, I enjoyed that because it allows fans to open their mind
9:52across the league and follow other players all around, regardless if they're on their fan, uh, their team.
9:57Yeah. You know, I, I grew up in Pittsburgh and, uh, and so I grew up a Steelers fan, went to a
10:02ton of Steelers games growing up and stuff. And for me doing this as my job, I mean, this is, you know,
10:08I've been doing this now for over a decade, you know, as, as my full-time gig.
10:12And like what I've, I've just grown to appreciate what, how other teams build and how other teams do things.
10:17And like, like you, if you talk to 17 year old JJ about like enjoying what the Ravens are doing, you know,
10:23as a Steelers fan growing up, like he would, he would punch me in the face.
10:27Right. Because, but, but I, I can sit here and just appreciate the game more because of what fantasy football has done
10:33in terms of me just understanding the game on a deeper level and stuff.
10:37I was going to say for me, I would say 95% of the people that come up to me are like, Hey,
10:42I had you on fantasy or you crushed it for me in fantasy, or I made some money betting on you.
10:48And so that has opened my eyes up to enjoying it.
10:51And you asked about the locker room. It is not in the locker room.
10:54It is not in the locker room at all.
10:57We, as players typically do not pay attention to any of this stuff.
11:00I am definitely an outlier when it comes to getting into this, because for me, I realized that, Hey, there's two sides of the, of the NFL.
11:07There are a business. There's the one that we get paid directly.
11:10And then there's the community that's out there to get into the community.
11:13You got to do some extra stuff. You got to go out and kind of, you know, be active in some sort of way.
11:20Some people do it through charity camps, things like that.
11:22Yeah. I was like, this fantasy thing is massive.
11:24People love this stuff. And so I'm like, I'm going to start my own show, start my own fantasy leagues and really get into that side.
11:31So that's kind of been my outside of football interests that I've been, you know, continue to, to invest.
11:36And so most people get, they get the toxic side because here's the deal.
11:40Yeah. Here's the deal. There's way more positivity in fantasy than there is toxicity.
11:43However, however, maybe not sports betting, sports betting is a little different because we'll get into that in a second, but fantasy
11:49football, way more positivity because people have a long stretch of time that you can go up and down.
11:54But the thing is it's the negativity that speaks loudest.
11:57Yes. Right. So when you're in my DMS and comments, I'm just seeing that I'm just seeing people just raging.
12:02Right. I'm not seeing all the positive, like, thank you.
12:04Thank you. Thank you. So if you're not really into it and like following it that closely, you're going to see all that.
12:10And this, these people suck. I hate this. Um, for the most part, it's a, it's a pretty positive community.
12:15And here's my thing. I say, I tell this to my wife all the time.
12:19It's like in fantasy, especially it sucks to suck.
12:22If you suck, you're going to hear about it.
12:24If you don't suck, they're going to love you.
12:26You know? So, Hey, the better you are, the better it's going to be.
12:30Well, you also, you know, you're coming from the perspective that, you know, you were undrafted.
12:34And by the way, I have a, I have a prospect model that I built that, you know, tries to project how
12:40well running backs and wide receivers and tight ends are going to perform at the NFL level.
12:44And unfortunately I only, cause I have to set the line, the like, you know, guardrails somewhere.
12:49And I don't have undrafted who didn't go to the combine players in said my otherwise, cause it's all based on like, like adjusted production in college.
12:56So like, you know, program, and age adjusted stuff.
12:58I mean, I know your production profile in college is absolutely bonkers, but you were not in the, in the zap model.
13:04I call it the Zachary's an adjusted prospect model, but you coming from, you know, an undrafted background where, you know, I
13:09don't, you know, expectations weren't as high as the first overall pick, obviously.
13:13And so I do think, I do think, I do think though, that like, there's a story to you in particular with
13:18fantasy football where you were sort of this, like, you know, like underdog type story where you were, you were, and then
13:24you ended up being like a fantasy football hero to so many people because, you know, they probably acquired you, like you
13:30said, off the waiver wire, or they didn't even need to like go after you in their rookie draft and dynasty or something like that.
13:36And then you absolutely dominated and you were the, you know, the, the PPR scammer out there catching all these passes and
13:42you were helping people out that way. And so like, I would imagine that you are coming, you know, like you've hopefully
13:48you've experienced mostly good, like you're saying, which, which is really, really great.
13:51But I do, you know, speaking of like younger running backs and such, when you are looking at and you're watching a
13:57young running back, what are the things that, that you were looking for that, that tell you whether he can play or
14:02not that maybe the box score isn't showing? Yeah.
14:05I love the setup. I would say this. And I was, I say, I took the stairs, you know, you can get
14:10to the end point, which is making a team and hopefully having an impact.
14:14Some people get the elevator, which is what I call the draft.
14:17Some people get the fast track, right? Hey, elevator, bring top floor, first round pick.
14:21It might be a seventh round pick, but you're still getting the elevator.
14:24You still have some investment from that team. People that had to take the stairs of the undrafted people like myself, that there was, there was no expectations.
14:31There was no investment from that team. So we had to earn every ounce of expectation.
14:36You're taking, you're taking the stairs of a skyscraper, you know, in your, in your case.
14:40100%. So here's the thing here. Let me answer your question too, because you asked like, what, what is it that you can't see in the box score?
14:47Well, it's not for many, but the mindset, it is.
14:50Straight up mindset want to like, there's, there's so much that goes into this game.
14:53And you hear about the mental part sometimes that pops up and the mental part of the game is so impactful that
14:59if you are locked in, in the mind, let me give you perspective of how I treated it.
15:04For me, this wasn't just an opportunity to go and play football at the next level.
15:08I treated it like my life depended on it.
15:10I was the most stressed I've ever been in my life going through my OTAs in my training camp as a rookie, because this was it.
15:17I have to make this work because there's nothing else besides this.
15:20And for me, I just remember nonstop studying, being stressed.
15:23I was the only rookie too. So I remember I was breaking down crying one time because I was so stressed.
15:28I never moved up the depth chart one time I was six string.
15:32And I felt like I was doing everything I possibly could.
15:34I'm studying extra. I would get like four reps a day, but my four reps would be solid.
15:39It wasn't like I was making crazy Superman plays, but I was doing my job.
15:43I was in the right spot, right time using the right technique.
15:46And so I was doing the things that I was supposed to be doing because I was so locked in on not
15:52messing up when I got an opportunity because I didn't know when I was going to get those because it was far between.
15:58There's no six string. You're up. It's third string.
16:00Austin, hey, go snag a rep. And so I was 100% mentally engulfed in this opportunity.
16:04And yes, I had the physical attributes as far as like, hey, I was fast.
16:08I wasn't the fastest. I was strong. I wasn't the strongest, but I made it work.
16:12I was compact. I was able to stand my ground.
16:15And then the mental part, I was using the right technique, the right time.
16:18And the coaches trusted me. So coaches continue to build trust in me because I was doing what they were coaching to.
16:24And then I was showing the, hey, I can have some upside as well.
16:28So I remember my first kind of recognition from our head coach, Anthony Lynn at the time I was on special team scout team.
16:34So I was on, I was the punt. I was the practice squad punt team for the punt team.
16:39And I was the personal protector, the guy that stands in the back.
16:42And I just remember I was flying every time and he jogged back.
16:45There's no like backup for the scout team. You draw back and you go again for the next group.
16:50And I'm full. I'm just, I'm running like my life depends on it down the field.
16:55And Anthony Lynn comes into the special teams meeting.
16:57He's like, dang, like, hey, coach Stu, that's our special teams coach.
17:00Like who's number three? That guy's flying down the field.
17:03And coach Stu goes, that's, that's Eckler. He's been giving us a hell of a look, um, all camp.
17:07And so that was like my first recognition of like, okay, maybe they see me.
17:11And, um, my favorite stat to this day actually is I led the entire league and tackles on punt.
17:16Um, my rookie year, never covered a punt in my life.
17:19I've never been on punt, but I treated it like, again, like my life depended on it.
17:24And so that was the opportunity. That was what was going to get me in the league.
17:28And, um, that was the thing that they couldn't measure.
17:30And that's why I kind of was the underdog story because my mentality was able to push me through, but you can't, you can't measure that on paper.
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18:57Yeah, so hey, look, it shows itself in different ways, but can you interpret that?
19:01Can you interpret that as like, oh, this guy's actually really locked in.
19:04Sorry to go on another little tangent, but like the mental side, like understanding the coaches.
19:08Like, I didn't realize this until I really got into it, but coaches are so, so on edge when it comes to
19:14making sure people are doing the right thing. Because if someone messes up, like let's say I go out there and mess
19:19up a rep, you know, the head coach is looking at my position coach.
19:23Like, what the hell is he doing? Why is he in the wrong?
19:26Why is he not know what he's supposed to do?
19:29So now he's on the hot seat. He's looking like, oh, shoot.
19:32Like, I got it. So he wants to make sure that if he puts a guy out there, that he knows what the heck he's doing.
19:39And especially on third down, when it comes to, if you get the quarterback hit, it's everybody.
19:43It's, it's, it's on the player. It's on the, the offensive line coach.
19:47It's on the running back coach. And so it's like, everyone has a trickle effect on how players can do on the field.
19:53And so I was able to, again, be in the right spot, right time, gain the trust.
19:57And I slowly started to build off of that.
19:59Speaking of the coaching stuff, something that I've always kind of preached to folks is that like, you know, we're, we're evaluating running back talent.
20:06We obviously are hoping and praying, crossing our fingers that talent wins out, that the best running back that, that, you know, ends up seeing the most work.
20:13Right. But ultimately running back, arguably more than some other positions will come down to a coaching decision.
20:18Right. Like if coach wants to split a backfield, you can split a backfield, you know, you can go that, that direction.
20:23I would first ask if that's something that you generally agree with that, like coach to coach, you're just going to see different preference.
20:30And then that could just lead to different volume, which can then lead to obviously different fantasy production.
20:34And then are there instances, you don't have to name names or anything, but are there instances where you just like say
20:40to yourself, why are these teams deploying these running backs this way?
20:43I think, you know, what you just talked about really resonated with me with like new England's backfield last year, where you're
20:49talking about guys who are just doing their job and are, are, you know, guys that, that the coaches might, might just
20:54prefer more than what the average fan sees. I think that's what we probably saw a lot of between Ramondre and Travion
21:00last year, where it was like, you know, you see the explosive back and Travion, you see what he can do, like
21:06that game against Tampa Bay, where he goes absolutely bonkers and nuclear.
21:09Right. But Ramondre, aside from the fumbling stuff, which he did fix, you know, during the, after the first month of the
21:15season, like he just is doing everything right. Right.
21:17I mean, he's good in pass pro he's able to, to, to grind out the tough yards, et cetera, et cetera.
21:22So, you know, I guess my, my, you know, to go back to the question, is this a real thing in your
21:28opinion with the way that coaches just, they're like, I want to divvy it this way.
21:32This is just the way it's going to be.
21:34And we have to be cognizant of that as fantasy managers.
21:37But then, you know, are there instances where you're sitting on your couch or if you're analyzing the game, whatever the case
21:43may be, you're just like, what in the world is this coach doing splitting the backfield like this?
21:48Yeah. I think there's a few different instances that play themselves out and you kind of see them throughout the league.
21:53I'll name some teams as we get into it, but they're, first of all, playing.
21:57Running back as a rookie is tough because you, it's, it's really, it's the past protection.
22:01Yeah. The past protection is the biggest mental hurdle that coaches have to be able to trust and get over to trust
22:07you to go in on third downs or passing situations.
22:09Two minutes, third downs, end of games, or Hey, you're down by a few scores.
22:13Those types of scenarios, you got to have a court running back in the game that can protect for your quarterback.
22:19And if you can't, it's going to be hard for you to get on the field, no matter how you might be the most explosive player ever.
22:26However, we got to throw the ball 20 yards down the field.
22:29We can't keep handing it off to you. So that's going to play a factor into it with rookies.
22:34And that's what I see a lot with rookies.
22:36And that's what I've seen from my experience is rookie running backs have a tough time learning pass protection because it's not simple.
22:42Offensive lines are going to take the five people.
22:44You got everybody else. Right. They're going to take the five base.
22:47You got, and we're sorting stuff. We're bumping stuff.
22:50They're moving around on defense. It's like trying to just eliminate what you shouldn't.
22:53Got to be, got to be frightening too. I mean, these, yeah.
22:56260 pound linebackers go fast. People are fast, right?
22:59You got D line coming up the field. You got people looping and stuff.
23:02So you're going to be able to track with your eyes and know where people can fit.
23:07And so that is the biggest hurdle that you'll see.
23:09Maybe that's what happened out in, um, in new England with you guys, uh, or, or Travion, I should say.
23:15I don't know. I don't know that scenario, but that played a factor into it.
23:18Going back to the trust though. Let's talk about the guys that don't, don't, that actually can stay on the field.
23:24There are a few guys in the league that can actually demand that type of respect and Hey, can actually do all three phases.
23:30You know, I think a Christian McCaffrey is one that's done that.
23:33Saquon's done that. Um, and so I think Dalvin Cook's another one that's done that guys that they're just all around good
23:39between the tackles can pass, protect, can catch the ball out of the backfield.
23:42Those guys are going to be really easy to work with because they're going to be on top of their stuff.
23:48And those guys have put a standard out there that, Hey, I, I deserve to be at this top level getting paid top dollars.
23:54So I can, I need to stay on the field, but you're going to have scenarios.
23:58Like you do with maybe like Derrick Henry, where he's so dominant and just running the ball that he might not be
24:04the best to put on there out there on third down.
24:07You put like a Hill out there or something like that.
24:10So you're going to have these different scenarios that play themselves out and here the season's long.
24:14So if you can have some people to supplement people's strengths for me, like right, right now in my current position, I'm
24:20definitely going to be a third down two minute end of game right passing situation type of player.
24:24That's where I'm at my career. That's where I've been strong and that's where I'm at right now.
24:29And so you're going to want to compliment. And guess what?
24:32Having that compliment is actually great. You still incorporate in a way that you can kind of hide it.
24:37So it's not as obvious all the time, but they do their homework too.
24:40They know what the strengths are and stuff like that.
24:43But for longevity throughout the season, it's going to help your backfield just as much.
24:47You know, what's the biggest worry with Christian every single year?
24:50Well, he's going to get hurt, but when he's not hurt, dude is the most dynamic player in the league at the running back position.
24:56Right. And so you want to have some of that maintenance.
24:59So it's not bad to have, you know, a tandem and stuff like that, or someone, another backup.
25:04Now, from a fantasy perspective, if you see a committee, I run away.
25:07I'm not even going near committee. You know, that's how we had an actually Washington, you know, the past two years, there's
25:13like three running backs that are rotating through there.
25:15You have guys that can run a couple of guys that can pass.
25:18And so in that backfield, Hey, you have maybe a few guys that you can trust.
25:23Maybe they're not all the strongest in certain spots.
25:25So you kind of let them kind of go through, get flow, just trying to keep everyone fresh and contribute.
25:30And so I'll end with that is, so yeah, I'm always looking for the dominant, you know, if I can.
25:35And then a duo is not as bad, but then I stay away from the committees.
25:39Yeah. Yeah. I feel that. Another question I have, you know, you obviously being one of the premier like pass catching backs
25:45that we've seen really over the last decade in the league.
25:48I'm curious, you know, when, when I'm analyzing pass catching stuff, especially when I'm looking at guys from college to the pros,
25:54like there's a lot of predictive metrics that are, and I'm, I'm the nerd in the space.
25:58You know, I do things analytically and I'm looking at things from that perspective.
26:02And there are definitely some things that I can look at analytically that help predict and project how well a guy's going
26:07to be a pass catcher in the NFL. But regardless of that, like I've gotten to the point where I almost view
26:13running back as, and I want you to break this down because it's, it's something that I think is really important where
26:19I have like three buckets of pass catching running back.
26:21There's the guys who are like extremely elite. They can line up all over the field.
26:25You'll see them in the slot, you know, Christian obviously being one of them McCaffrey being one, but then there's the guys
26:31who we just know it's just not what they do.
26:34I mean, maybe you could put Derek Henry in there, but I'm even thinking more like Gus Edwards type players.
26:39Like it's just not, not, not their thing, but they're obviously bruisers.
26:42They're great in between the tackles. I would say that those extremes are, are, are, are pretty narrow.
26:47There's not a ton of players that are in those buckets necessarily, but there's a large bucket in the, in the middle
26:52where when called upon, they can do their thing.
26:55It's just that it depends on what schematically things look like and what they are called to do.
26:59Right. Good example of that would be like Kenneth Walker, who I think is actually a fine pass catcher, but he's been
27:05in these scenarios aside from the one year with Ryan grub, where he's seeing like an 8% target share where, you know,
27:11instead of that, like 13% type spike. And so my question to you is like, what are the things that you're looking
27:16for that separate a running back being a good pass catcher or a great pass catcher to one that might have some work to do?
27:23Yeah. I think a big part of that actually that you didn't mention was the coordinator and what is the coordinator's philosophy.
27:29And the reason I say that is because like, let's, let's use an example from my past at the charges.
27:34We get Joe Lombardi over from the saints who had just had Alvin Kamara.
27:37So a lot of that, that passing game was little dump dumps down to the flat, right?
27:42Checkdowns are like number three in the progression. Usually the number five in the progression.
27:46And so now, Hey, we're going to give Austin the ball in space.
27:49He's going to be in the, he's going to catch a lot more balls.
27:53He's going to get some screens down the red zone, all of that.
27:56If you have a player that can not even, and here's the thing, my average, I think, you know, route run or
28:02catch when I was catching the ball was like negative two yards.
28:05Right. Right. Right. I'm catching the ball behind the line of scrimmage.
28:08Right. And so I'm considered a, a pass catching running back, but it doesn't mean I'm routing guys up out down the field.
28:14Like I'm just getting dump offs and I'm making people miss.
28:17And so avoidability is going to help you as one of the premier, be a premier pass catcher.
28:21Cause as a running back, you're a lot of times behind the line of scrimmage after protecting and then everyone else is
28:27dumping, uh, backing up from, uh, for defense. And so I go from Joe Lombardi lead the league in touchdowns two years in a row.
28:33And then all of a sudden we get Kellen Moore who comes in from Dallas and what did he do?
28:39They were just the number one, uh, passing offense in the league.
28:42That means they're trying to sling that thing down the field.
28:45And all of a sudden Austin's productivity tanks. Um, like I'm just not existing anymore because now I'm number five in the
28:50progression as opposed to number three in the progression.
28:53Um, and so the philosophy of the, of the coordinator is definitely going to play into that.
28:57But then also as a route run or as a pass catching running back, it is the avoidability because a lot of
29:03times it's going to be something that's a short pass.
29:05Can you make the first guy miss? And so that is going to help determine whether you're a route runner or not
29:11from an analytics standpoint, because you're gonna get more balls thrown to you if you can make a man miss.
29:16And so you can see these guys that are averaging between like nine and 10 yards per reception, those guys are making the first guy miss.
29:23They are not getting down the field and actually, you know, catching routes down the field like that as a running back.
29:29That's just not how our position works. So I would use that metric to, um, the avoidability to, you know, kind of
29:34enhance your, your analytics of the past catching backs.
29:37Yeah. It's interesting because I did, I did a lot of research last year on just yards per route run because everyone
29:42uses yards per route run at wide receiver. And actually from what I found was really predictive of future target share.
29:48So like if you had high yards per route run rates, future seasons, you would actually see an uptick and just volume
29:53raw volume at the position as opposed to that's why, like, you know, a player like, uh, Javante Williams, for instance, who
29:59has not been that efficient through the air, but you know, it's kind of the default in Dallas right now, but it's
30:05a little bit scary from like a pro an overall profile standpoint, because you know, it's more fragile, right?
30:10Because what if there was a player there that could step in and just be a little bit more efficient through the air?
30:16Whereas like Jalen Warren dude is just unreal every year, you know, on a per route run basis.
30:20Now, obviously last year there was a little bit of that Kenneth Gainwell stuff going on, but yeah, I mean like it's,
30:26it's a really, to me, it's just one of the more interesting because it's so important in fantasy.
30:31The pass catching stuff is like everything in fantasy.
30:33So it's always been something I've been, I've been just, you know, really, really interested in.
30:37All right. Just a couple more questions before I let you go.
30:40We're on the verge of watching a whole lot of football.
30:43Thank God. It's here. Finally, which fantasy players, any position do you think could, could break out this year?
30:48I have a few. I think David Montgomery is going to have a good year.
30:52I think this is, I know he's getting older, you know, in, in running back terms anyway, and he's in it and somewhat of a split carry backfield.
30:59We'll see, but I think a new contract and a new scenario with a team that's looking to make a better, better run.
31:05You know, they had an early round exit, uh, the Texans last year.
31:08So I'm, I'm thinking David Montgomery is going to have a, have a, have a big year this year.
31:13Um, and he's kind of getting broken up against, uh, away from, uh, Jameer Gibbs, obviously.
31:17And so I think I'm looking for him. Um, he's one of my, kind of my, like not a sleeper cause he's,
31:23he's made a move for himself, but I think he's a little bit further down on the list.
31:28Um, then I think he's going to, I think he has a potential to finish in the top 10.
31:33In my opinion, it's his to lose. Um, I like that new energy though, of new team, um, new contract kind of energy kind of prove it type.
31:40Hey, this is, this is what I can do type of energy.
31:43And then I think Lab McConkie is going to be another one.
31:46Keenan Allen had 88 catches with the chargers last year because he just has that history.
31:50And that's what he does. Um, he gets open on third down.
31:53I used to call him Mr. Third down when I played with him, but I think because there was some injuries with
31:59Ladd last year and then Keenan coming in and taking a lot of that lion's share, he's not competing.
32:04Like Keenan and Ladd basically play the same position.
32:06Ladd can go all over. Keenan can go all over.
32:09So I think Ladd's going to be one that's going to have another pop-off year here in year three for him.
32:14I love, I love the Ladd call, especially. I mean, he, so like Mike McDaniels offenses, there's a lot of, you know, one, two wide receivers.
32:21He doesn't run a lot of a lot. And so like when you get fewer wide receivers on the field, it just,
32:27you just hyper target those guys and Ladd's numbers, Ladd's numbers with, with two or fewer wide outs on the field are just, are just bonkers.
32:34So I'm very excited for him this year. All right.
32:36Before I let you go, one bold prediction for this season can be anything.
32:40Uh, but let's hear it. My bold prediction is actually another Chargers reference, but O'Marrion Hampton.
32:44I have him for leading the league in rushing touchdowns, uh, this year.
32:47So that's my bold prediction. I just did a, uh, my bold predictions piece.
32:51That was one of my bold predictions. Exactly. Exactly.
32:53Yeah. Are you, are you like, do you think he can fit in that?
32:57Like, is it all good? There's been people who are like iffy on Amarrion Hampton's talent.
33:01I loved him as a prospect. I thought, you know, he got kind of an unfair shake last year, given the offensive line injuries and stuff.
33:08Like, are you, are you in, like, you think he could be a dominant?
33:11I think the usage down in the run with the running back position with McDaniels down there is going to feature him.
33:17Um, they're going to try to run the ball in.
33:20And so, I mean, if you can run the ball in, especially with a hard ball who already likes to run the
33:25ball, I think he can be featured down there in the goal line and gobble up all of those, all those rushing touchdowns.
33:31I love it. I love it, man. Uh, thank you so much for the time.
33:35Let everyone know, you know, what you're working on, you know, plug whatever you want to.
33:39Yeah, absolutely. So obviously fantasy is here. And actually I have a national fantasy league that I'm running this year.
33:44So each week we're going to see who the best in fantasy sports is every single week.
33:49We have a ton of prizes. It's free to play.
33:51It's at fantasy Royale sports. We have an app and a website if you want to check it out.
33:56But again, nationwide, everyone plays with their buddies. So you can be better than your friends, but we're trying to see who's the best in the nation.
34:03And this is all leading into me professionalizing fantasy sports next year as the commissioner.
34:07So as your commissioner for next year, fantasy sports, um, you know, looking forward to having everyone that come out and compete.
34:13So fantasy Royale, check it out and I'll see you on the leaderboards.
34:16That's awesome, man. That's awesome. As usual, everyone, make sure you check out late round.com subscribe to the show, subscribe to the YouTube channel, all that good stuff.
34:23Otherwise, thanks for tuning in. What does Drew Barrymore reach for at home?
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